Trastamara TL

At the moment yes, my idea is to make it more centralized, but I am not sure how to do it.

Any ideas are welcome.

Do you mean the HRE or the German Empire?

Well, any war should help these two to unite behind some strong emperor. The Ottomans would be perfect, as would be French or Calvinist uprisings.

Actually, OTL there were some tries to reform the empire at around that time. They set up "Reichskreise", that is they collected some minor territories to one larger region under the "presidency" of the mightiest prince there and they introduced a common court and a tax that would go directly to the empire: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imperial_Circle.
This timeline, the HRE lacks many of the big princes, so does the German empire. Especially the German Empire is more compact, what should help, and both have less religious differences, what should help, too. So I'd propose pretty much the same development as OTL, but successfully. And I'd add a war to help the emperor of the respective empires or the need for suppression of calvinist uprisings...

I think a main reason that the Imperial reform failed was that the Reichstag only met unregularly. On the other side, a regular Reichstag would ressemble pretty much the British parliament in 1300 or 1400.
It seems to me that you prefer such a development, since you already started it in Spain, if i see that right.
 
Do you mean the HRE or the German Empire?

Well, any war should help these two to unite behind some strong emperor. The Ottomans would be perfect, as would be French or Calvinist uprisings.
German, the HRE is something nominal at the moment. I am not sure if it will survive Philip...

Actually, OTL there were some tries to reform the empire at around that time. They set up "Reichskreise", that is they collected some minor territories to one larger region under the "presidency" of the mightiest prince there and they introduced a common court and a tax that would go directly to the empire: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imperial_Circle.
This timeline, the HRE lacks many of the big princes, so does the German empire. Especially the German Empire is more compact, what should help, and both have less religious differences, what should help, too. So I'd propose pretty much the same development as OTL, but successfully. And I'd add a war to help the emperor of the respective empires or the need for suppression of calvinist uprisings...

I think a main reason that the Imperial reform failed was that the Reichstag only met unregularly. On the other side, a regular Reichstag would ressemble pretty much the British parliament in 1300 or 1400.
It seems to me that you prefer such a development, since you already started it in Spain, if i see that right.


I'll think about it, sounds OK
 
The Religion Wars (updated)

1550 Valladolid debate. Las Casas views triumph over Sepulveda’s and judges and troops are sent to the America’s to make the settlers to obey the Laws of Indias. (They will be just a bit more effective than IOTL).
1551 The Hapsburg house suffers a terrible blow when the Bohemian and Moravian lands rebel with support from the German Emperor. An ottoman army raids Bavaria and Tyrol, but they just sack some towns, burn the fields and take some cattle.
The Pope makes a call to the English king to participate a council to end the division of Christianity, but Edward’s envoyees do not arrive on time to Rome before war erupts.
The combined fleets of Spain and France attack England. The French manage to land an army near Dover and another one in Southampton, although the French fleet suffers terrible losses in the process. Calais is also under siege of French forces. A Spanish army lands in Ireland, sparking a rebellion against the English. Catholic agents try to arise the local catholic population but to no effect. In the north the Scottish invade a siege York.
The French army defeats the English one, but it is unable to siege London, lacking supplies it has to retreat to the south of London during the winter. The situation of the Allies is better in Ireland as English forces return to England and abandon the island.
Henry II publishes the edict of Orleans: the Huguenots will be expelled of France and their lands confiscated. Most of them rebel and the king is forced to pull back some forces from England in order to cope with the Huguenot forces. Some flee to the north of Flanders where the local Calvinists shelter them.
The Spanish court is officially established in Seville, where Miguel I orders the building of an impressive Royal Palace.
Foundation of the University of Mexico.
1552 Charles of Hapsburg meets John Frederick of Saxony in Magdeburg. The Holy Roman Empire is transformed into the German Empire, Charles recognizes John Frederick as the only Emperor. Bohemia and Moravia are ceded to Ludwig of Wittelsbach as compensation for his rights over Bavaria. The protestant part of Flanders is ceded to the Emperor. All the catholic bishoprics are deprived of their Elector character.
John Frederick of Saxony dies and Maurice of Saxony is the new Emperor.
During the summer campaign, the Spanish army reinforced with Irish militias lands in Wales and the North West of England, defeating Edward’s army near Manchester while French forces siege London again.
In France the Huguenots achieve some successes and they even take Oleans.
An Imperial army under Maurice of Saxony enters France, but they are defeated near St. Quentin. However the French victory is pyrrhic and inconclusive. Maurice retreats to Germany.
Edward VI is captured near Oxford by a small Irish force.
Foundation of Niew Amsterdam in Western Africa, thousands of calvinist colonists are sent there to alleviate the situation in the Netherlands.
1553 Emperor Maurice dies. Augustus of Wettin is appointed as new German Emperor. Charles of Hapsburg disputes him the throne with the help of some Elector Princes.
Edward is forced to cede the crown to Mary, who grants Irish independence. The Irish nobles accept a Spanish prince, Fernando de Trastámara, married to a French princess as king.
1554 The Huguenots are finally defeated in France with Spanish help. Some move to northern Germany and Niew Amsterdam as the Netherlands cannot host more refugees. Most of them remain in France although they vow Henry II as their legitimate king.
After the victory of the Restoration League, Charles of Hapsburg calls for the creation of an alliance of Catholic German princes for the liberation of Austria. Augustus who is enraged after Charles dared to dispute him the Imperial crown agrees with the ottomans to remain neutral in their conflict with the Hapsburg.
Fearing religious violence, thousands of Scottish Calvinists flee to Norway and Denmark.
1555 Miguel I accepts French presence in the Americas in the territory of Nouvelle Bretagne (OTL Georgia) and to the north. Scotland receives also permission for the creation of some colonies in the North of America (around Manhattan Island and Chesapeake bay).
Charles of Hapsburg dies in Innsbruck. His son Philip receives the lands of his father.
The Royal Palace of Seville is finished, becoming one of the wonders of the world.
1556 The Spanish Bishops propose to hold an ecumenical Council to solve the Imperial issue, the Reformation of the Church and the Turkish threat.
Emperor Augustus I invades the Netherlands trying to crush the Calvinist rebels. Henry II, fearing that he would invade France, mobilizes his army and requires Scottish and Spanish help.
Miguel I sends an small army to Naples. He plans to lead it to the North of Italy and then to Austria to fight against the turks, but he falls ill.
Mary I of England restores the Catholic Church in England and pursues non-Catholics that flee from England in another exodus. The German Emperor, enraged, decrees similar measures, depriving catholics of most of their civilian rights.
The following months the roads in Europe will be flooded with refugees fleeing from religious violence. Bands of Catholics group and present resistance in Germany. Bands of Calvinists and Anglicans start a guerrilla war in Scotland and England, while Calvinists in France also fight the royal forces.
1558 A Papal-Spanish army enters Austria from the south reaching Munich under the command of the Duke of Alva. They recover some towns in Austria and Tyrol.
Several skirmishes between French and Imperial forces take place in Lorraine.
Intense diplomatic activity and several attacks over corsair ports make the mahgreb princedoms to move away from the ottoman orbit. Some of them even declare themselves as Spanish Vassals.
Mary of England dies heirless. Causing a crisis with France and Spain that do not accept Elisabeth (that is in Denmark) as heir, and do not accept the others candidates, Mary Stuart or Fernando of Ireland. Finally Emmanuele Filiberto is accepted as king of England after abdicating of the Saboyan crown.
1559 An Ottoman army invades Italy threatening the Spanish communication lines with northern Italy.
Venice is under siege. The Dux proposes a Peace treaty to Suleiman. That he accepts in exchange of Cyprus and Crete. Henry II prepares to move to Milan.
1561 Battle of Pavia: the Ottoman army invades Milan in order to cut the Papal territories from France. They are stopped by Pavia where a French garrison resists; when everything seems lost a Spanish army under command of Alva appears from the North. The Ottoman army caught between two fires is crushed and destroyed.
Suleiman’s advisors notice that the ottoman army is badly outclassed by western style armies with more firepower and discipline. Unfortunately the only solution they find is hiring German mercenaries.
The Spanish army invades Venice and occupies it, preparing to recover the rest of Austria.
Augustus tries to create an army to invade France as the French king is busy in Italy, but the electors are tired of fighting other Christian nations that are fighting Muslim forces. They start to consider Spanish proposals about having an ecumenical council to settle all those disputes.
1562 Hispano-Hapsburg forces retake Graz.
The application Martín de Azpilicueta and the School of Salamanca’s ideas impulse an economic boom in Spain with the help of the American silver. Trade and banking start to be seen by Spanish noblemen as a way of increasing their power and not as a dirty activity. Wool will be woven in factories in Burgos, Valladolid and Santander. On the other hand the Cortes claims more power and regular meetings. The King is forced to cede in order to get money to support the army in Austria.
Construction of the cathedral of Merida in Mexico.
1565 A huge army composed of Spanish, Catholic germans, Italians and French led by Philip of Hapsburg and the Duke of Alva retakes and holds Vienna. The ottomans make up to three attempts to recover it, but their army is exhausted and they finally retreat to Buda.
The Great Mosque is converted back into a Cathedral.
Infant Miguel, heir of the Spanish crown, marries Mary of Hapsburg, sister of Philip.
1566 Suleiman “the Magnificent” dies.
The defeat in Vienna and the death of Suleiman causes riots in Istanbul. The crowds blame Roxelana and his son. Finally Selim II becomes Sultan after a civil war that will last ten months.
Several battles are fought in Bavaria, Flanders and the Rhine, some favour the Emperor and others not. Europe is exhausted and finally Lutherans and Catholics agree to hold a Council in Strasburg.
1568-1572 The Council of Strasburg ends without reconciliation between Catholics and Reformed, but they agree that the lands will follow the faith of their rules but free passage would be allowed to followers of other faiths to settle in other places. The Emperor would give back the Hapsburg lands back except those where the Protestants are a majority (like Moravia and Bohemia) and the German Empire will only include Reformed Church lands.
The German Catholics will recreate again the Holy Roman Empire.
The Papacy that was holding Venice, cedes it to Philip of Hapsburg as a counterweight to the power of France and Spain in Italy.
Selim offers shelter to all the prosecuted by their religion in Christian Europe, the proposal is accepted by lots of Calvinists that try to make their way to the Empire.
The French King caught between his calvinist rebel subjects and his debts is forced by Philip of Habsburg to cede him Milan in exchange for support against the Huguenots.
1569 Small clashes are fought between ottoman and Austrian forces in Hungary.
Birth of Infant Diego to Mary and Miguel the heir to the Spanish throne.
Philip I is crowned in Vienna as Holy Roman Emperor.
Miguel I will not attend to the coronation as he dies in Naples. He will be known as Miguel I “el Grande”. His heir Miguel is crowned in Seville.
1571 The Miquelinas islands (OTL Philippines) are incorporated to the Spanish crown and named after the new king. Foundation of Manila.
1572 Miguel II calls for a crusade in Morocco against the sultan of Fez.
The French manage to create some factories in India, while Scotland builds factories in the Cape.
Riots in Amsterdam between Catholics and Calvinists endanger the conclusion of Strasbourg council.
1574 Declaration of Metz in which the Lutheran and Catholic churches agree to start theological discussions, condemn the prosecution on religious issues of Christians and the primacy of the Papacy plus the college of Cardinals. The Calvinists drop from the declaration and the tension arises in the territories where they are majority.
Bullinger claims from Zurich that the German reformed church has committed treachery over Luther’s legacy.
Riots between Catholics and Calvinists arise in several Swiss towns.
1575 Fez is conquered by Miguel II.
Religious riots between Calvinists and Catholic-Lutherans spark all around Europe. They are especially intense in the Netherlands and France.
1576 New Religion Laws in France where the Huguenots are expelled. Thousands of them will flee to Calvinist Switzerland and to the Ottoman Empire.
The Netherlands rebel against the German Emperor and the exiled Calvinists in Norway flee to the Netherlands. Due to the increased population, the United Provinces meditate creating some colonies in Africa and decree the expulsion of Catholics and Lutherans.
1578 The German Emperor is unable to control the rebellion in the Netherlands. The catholic swiss cantons accept Hapsburg rule in exchange for protection against the Calvinist ones.
A Spanish fleet sacks and destroys Niew Amsterdam, they abandon the burned town and check periodically to verify that they have been eradicated. However the colonists moved to the interior. there the Sultn of Mali, fearing the threat of an moroccan army made of Andalusian moors recruits them. The army of Mali with the addition of the calvinist refugees defeats the moroccans.
1582 Martin VI is elected Pope by a cardinal college including Catholic and Lutheran cardinals. The Schism is officially closed. However the German church keeps her Patriarcade. The Danish and Swedish Protestant churches under pressure of their kings will remain independent although they agree to settle many theological issues. The Polish Reformed Church will also keep her Patriarcade and close ties with Rome.
The Basque towns request again participation in Castilian courts and full incorporation in the Castilian crown. This time Miguel II accepts.
1584 Danish and Swedish reformed churches move closer to the Calvinist approach and away from the new Unified Catholic Chuch.
1585 Emperor Augustus I dies, his son Christian I is appointed as Emperor.
Some units formed by calvinist christians are used by the Ottoman army against Persia with an incredible effect. The new military advances will be soon incorporated to the rest of the Imperial army.
1587 After the death of the Sultan of Mali, the dutch calvinists seize the power of the Sultanate with the help of Andalusian moor slaves. They create the Free Republic of Mali.
1591 Henry II of France dies. Francis II is crowned and will follow a more aggressive policy in the Colonies against the Spanish and of bigger inner tolerance towards the huguenots that are allowed to settle in the colonies.
The Spanish Cortes ask for more political reformations. Miguel II cedes in some points but forces all the Cortes of the three Kingdoms (Castile, Portugal and Aragon) to be held in Seville in a Palace built specially for them. The Trastamara king thinks that this way he could control them easily or even use the delegates of towns of one Kingdom against another.
1592 England creates some factories in the Caribbean and Africa with Spanish permission.
Innocentius X is elected Pope. He was a Spanish cardinal and his election reflects the power of Spain.
1595 Incorporation of most of Tunis to the Spanish crown.
Word of the cratio of the Free Republic of Mali reach the calvinists of Europe. Some of them move there.
1596 Growing tensions between France and Savoy.
1598 Reorganization of the overseas Hispanic Possessions, the trade with the colonies boosts the creation of private enterprises. The School of Salamaca of Economy is created.
1599 Some members of the School of Salamanca are given possitions in the Universities of Sto. Domingo and Mexico. Incorporation to the Spanish cortes of representatives of the towns of the Kingdom of Naples and Sicily.
An ottoman army crushes a persian one near Tehran. The Sahfavid Empire is destroyed and its territories nominally incorporated to the Ottoman Empire. The Moghul emperor with spanish help prepares to invade the Eastern provinces of the Persian Empire.

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The Colonial Expansion

By 1600 the World is dominated by the Spanish Monarchy, but France, Scotland, Ireland, England and the United Provinces are searching for their Empires.
In Asia the Ottomans, the Russians and the Moghuls prepare to clash.

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Ottoman Expansion

1601 Philip of Hapsburg dies. The new Holy Roman Emperor is his son Charles VI. The Moghuls invade Eastern Persia.
1602 Diego I is crowned king of Spain after the abdication of his father that retreats to a monastery in the mountains of Granada.
1605 The french try to create some settlements in the Caribbean, but they are expelled by the Spanish fleet. The tensions grow between both nations. War is prevented by a new Huguenot uprising.
The Sahfavid territories are finally pacified and divided between the Ottomans and the Moghuls.
1606 Foundation of the University of Manila.
The Swiss Calvinists invade the Catholic cantons under Hapsburg rule. Charles VI invades the calvinist cantons.
Secret conversations between the Swiss Calvinists, the Ottoman Empire and the United Provinces that end up with an alliance.
War erupts between France and Savoy that receives help from England, the Holy Roman Empire and Tuscany.
1607 An ottoman army invades the Hapsburg territories, taking again Viena. Charles VI claims for Spanish and German help and abandons Savoy in their war against France.
A combined German army is crushed near Prague and the town is besieged, but as winter arrives the ottomans retreat to Austria.
An ottoman army is defeated in the Veneto by an small Spanish army thanks to the new fortifications.
The Pope requires Savoy, England and France to sign a peace treaty, but the hostilities will only end with a new Huguenot uprising. The English help means intense harassing in their overseas possitions. The Huguenots require ottoman protection and help.
1608 Francis III is elected new king of France after the death of Francis II. In order to get the support of the Huguenots he acknowledges their rights and declares himself protector of the Swiss Calvinists and of the United Provinces, putting himself in an uncomfortable possition as that way he would be an ottoman ally.
For the new campaign the ottomans increase their artillery power in order to prevent the failure of the previous campaign. This time Prague falls to the ottoman army and they even reach Berlin that is sacked and burned.
Some north African territories are retaken by the ottomans, but a spanish-magrebi army manages to stop them in Constantine.
1612 The Polish king Henry Walecy enters the war against the ottomans and an allied german-polish-austrian army attacks ottoman positions in Prague. The massive attack is a complete failure as the allied forces attack before the austrians arrive, they are destroyed and only part of the austrian forces barely manage to retreat to Bavaria. The polish king Henry Walecy dies in battle and the german Emperor Augustus II is captured and forced to sign an humiliating peace: Bohemia and Moravia would be ceded to the Ottomans, he would renounce to the title of Emperor, acknowledge the United Provinces independence, renounce to Schleswig-Holstein in favour of Denmark and pay a yearly tribute to the Ottoman Sultan.
1614 Thinking that everything is done in the West the ottomans move against the Poles that are trying to choose a king. The crown is claimed by the Swedish King Gustavus Adolphus that invades norhtern Poland while the ottomans enter by the south.
Hispano-Hapsburg forces invade Austria retaking Viena one more time, this time they arrive with an army of masons and military engineers that upgrade the defenses of the town.
1616 Treaty of Lvov between the Ottomans and the Swedish for the partition of Poland.
The ottomans make another attempt over Viena but they are stopped by the new fortifications and the presence of an Spanish Army. A ten years ceasefire is signed between the Holy Roman Empire, Spain and the Ottomans that are exhausted and trying to incorporate fully the newly acquired territories.
1618 War in the Americas between Ireland and France, the Irish receive spanish help and they capture some french territories. The Scottish declare war on the side of France. England and the United
The ottomans create a fleet for the Indian Ocean and start attacking spanish possitions.
1621 End of the conflict in the Americas with a new design of the areas for each nation. The winners are clearly Spain-Ireland but somehow England and the United Provinces have achieved some outposts there.
The HRE ends the annexation of Swiss cantons. The Calvinists flee to France.
1622 A huge naval base is built in Manila to protect the spanish territories in the East Indies and India as most of the East African possitions have been lost either to the French, the Scottish or to the Ottomans.
Unrest in Portugal as most of the territories lost were settled by portuguese, Diego I allows the portuguese and aragonese to settle in Castilian territories in the Americas. Starting a massive migration that weakens unrest as the depopulated lands in Aragon and Portugal are occupied by castilians.
1625 Construction of Recife's Cathedral.
The ottomans prepare for the end of the ceasefire with the HRE and Spain.
But the spanish are also moving an alliance is signed with the Moghul in order to attack the Ottomans, before the end of the year.
1626 The Ottoman fleet preparing to attack Italy is defeated by an spanish one. On the land the Ottomans approach Viena, but the Sultan has to abandon as a Moghul army has invaded Persia. Sultan Mehmed V dies in battle against the Moghuls and a short civil war erupts between the heirs.
1628 The new ottoman Sultan Mehmed VI signs a peace treaty with the Moghul Empire, Spain and the HRE by which the borders with these nations are accepted by the ottomans and a perpetual ceasefire is signed.
1630 The ottomans incorporate the Bohemians and Moravians to their army that prove to be very valuable in attacks over fortified towns and prepare for new offensives. The Ottomans and the swedish prepare for the invassion and patition of Russia.
1631 The italian towns of Naples, Mesina, Palermo and Cagliari, and the african towns of Algers, Tunis and Fez are incorporated to the Spanish Cortes.
The african territories in East and South Africa are not claimed again as the full conquest of the East Indies is achieved. Even some settlements are made in Australia, where New Seville of the South Seas is founded in OTL Sydney.
1632 The Ottomans and the Swedes invade Russia. The Tzar dies in battle and the territories up to the Urals are divided between Sweden and the Ottomans. The swedish heir Gustavus marries an ottoman princess that converts to calvinism and an ottoman prince marries a swedish noblewoman that converts to Islam.
Potatos are used for human alimentation in central Spain for first time.
1634 Lots of russians flee to the East of the Urals where they found the Tzardom of Sibir.
1635 Construction of a cathedral in New Seville. The new continent is so huge that English and Irish settlements are allowed in the West coast of Australia.
1637 French agents manage to sign a treaty with the Japanese Shogun, the spanish are expelled to Nagashaki.
The Spanish Viceroy of the Miquelinas Islands signs an agreement with the chinese emperor of mutual defense against the French and the Japanese.
The Free Republic of Mali continues receiving calvinist colonists from France and refugees from Switzerland, that allow for furhter expansion.
1640 The Ottomans create some settlements in East Africa, but no further expansion is achieved as christian rebellions spark in Russia.
1642 The Sultan decides to use tactics similar to the ones used by the Spanish and proclaim the expulsion of thousands of russians. That are gladly welcome in the swedish part of Russia and in Sibir. Ucrania and Central Russia are populated by Persians and muslim Caucasians.
Pope Leo IX calls for a crusade to liberate Poland, Bohemia and Moravia, but all the catholic nations are either too exhausted or fearful of the ottoman power.
1644 Diego I dies in Seville, his son Carlos I is crowned king of Spain. The economic reformations made by his father have made of Northern Castile the main productor of wool textiles, in Andalucia cotton is cultivated and the printing presses in Aragon supply all the empire of books and paper. The American colonies have also improved their economy and they provide with silver, gold, wool, cacao, spices, sugarcane and other raw matherials, but the shipyards there produce most of the spanish ships. Trade with China and northern Europe is intense.
1647 Cultivation of potatoes for human alimentation in Europe spreadsThe in HRE territories and soon will expand in the rest of Germany and Italy.

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Emerging Powers

The war between Spain and the Ottomans in the Indian Ocean has brought slight changes there.
In Eurasia Sweden and the Ottoman Empires have increased their power.
In the Americas, the United Provinces, England and Denmark had taken advantage of the wars between the Tratamara nations Ireland and Spain and the Auld Alliance (France and Scotland).
In Africa, is the Free Republic of Mali an emerging power?

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Sweden and Ottomans dividing Russia? Until then it was fine, but now we're entering wank scenario.


Why? They tried it IOTL and ITTL the Ottomans are stronger...

My idea was not to make it last long, the ottomans will have another war against the Moghuls and the Russians will rebel.
 
How are the Swedes and Ottomans administering Russia? Through cooperative local boyars, I imagine. Given the nature of Russian society at the time, it's unlikely most Russian people even notice the change. Though I suppose the nobles are just awaiting their chance to rebel. The chance of Russia reforming after the rebellion are slight, I'm guessing.
 
Don't forget Russia's main advantage: It's damn big huge. You can take some cities, patrol some streets, and even that takes a lot of effort. Especially in an age before the telegraph is invented. On the other hand, you can't take a lot of money from Russia - it had neither big gold mines nor cash crops like the Caribbean sugar. So unless you want to turn Russia into Lebensraum, it doesn't pay off to occupy big parts of it.
 
Good points. What about a burned land policy except in the areas closer to Sweden and the Ottoman Empire where settlers could be installed to swedize or turkize those areas?
 
Good points. What about a burned land policy except in the areas closer to Sweden and the Ottoman Empire where settlers could be installed to swedize or turkize those areas?

Russia is just too big for that to work. The only effective way for the Swedes and Turks to control Russia is through complicit local nobles.
 
Russia is just too big for that to work. The only effective way for the Swedes and Turks to control Russia is through complicit local nobles.


What about a rebellion, most of Russia is liberated, but some local noblemen prefer to remain under swedish or even turkish domination. What could be the maximum extension that could be under foreign domination?

What about the Free Republic of Mali? Is it realistic? Any oppinions about their chances of creating an stable state?
 
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What about a rebellion, most of Russia is liberated, but some local noblemen prefer to remain under swedish or even turkish domination. What could be the maximum extension that could be under foreign domination?

What about the Free Republic of Mali? Is it realistic? Any oppinions about their chances of creating an stable state?

first, i would say not very much...the turks are gonna have a lot more trouble holding down all those conquered lands in austria and hungary, much less in russia...furthermore, sweden has a very good army, but it is also small...small home population and little gold to hire mercenaries...russia doesnt make too much sense for sweden to occupy-too much land, too few troops

if mali keeps receiving colonists...LOTS of colonists, then yes...i like the idea, though no world power there for quite some time...maybe a century or two?
 
Russia is just too big for that to work. The only effective way for the Swedes and Turks to control Russia is through complicit local nobles.

True.

Why not use some local nobles to split up Russia into several independent states fighting each other - thus undoing the unification by Moscow - and getting the Turks and Swedes some territories on the edge - like Novgorod to Sweden and Krim up to Kazan as a vassal state to the Ottomans?
 
True.

Why not use some local nobles to split up Russia into several independent states fighting each other - thus undoing the unification by Moscow - and getting the Turks and Swedes some territories on the edge - like Novgorod to Sweden and Krim up to Kazan as a vassal state to the Ottomans?

that seems to me to be the most realistic course...
 
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