Operation Gladio basically died an early death thanks to the Second Italian Civil War.
On the other hand, Operation Cliteus (aka arming enemies of the government in Mainland Italy) is doing great
The Red Boot: the history of Italy in the Cold War (TLIAW)
- Thread starter Gar48
- Start date
On the other hand, Operation Cliteus (aka arming enemies of the government in Mainland Italy) is doing great
Ok let's start
1 - sorry forgot any real boom unless on the relative term, we if lucky can become more or less rich like OTL Hungary under the communist regime and as said this is the best case scenario; no Marshall Plan and a multiyear civil war in addition of all the devastation of the second world war and an idiotic economic system...say that we will have 'le pezze al culo' will be very optimistic and this bring the second point
2 - The URSS, as the only nation that can give Italy the support that desperately and i mean really really really desperately need, well it will extract a step price, basically welcome Warsaw Pact and Comecon and this mean soviet troops in Italy and the Italian economy work for the benefit first of the new masters and later of the italian citizens and no sorry but weapons deals will not save the italian debt as it will be too high and frankly the great part of the possible client really don't have the mean to pay, Sorry but there is no way that the Soviet will accept Di Vittorio compromise, hell seem strange that he still breath and even if they don't have the mean for a regime change, well Rome can kiss goodbye to any help. The only option is to go on all four to Washington start kissing some shoes and begging some scraps pointing how not aligned and not very friendly with Moscow they are and maybe they can have a deal like Yugoslavia OTL, that will resolve a lot of problem but hardly to obtain with McArthur in charge and with Jugoslavia as already more Western friendly and not really on good terms with the italians at the moment
3 - NATO, ok i know that you have said that they have send massive help but somewhat and for some mirale (sorry but it's hard to believe), the communist had a better armed army, this bring out who is supporting them? The URSS? Ok but how, Tito? Ok but not only he also support the greeks communist and so his resources will be much more limited but we both know what is price will be. France on the other side will go to simply annex Ventimiglia and other border zone for security reason and never leave and that if they don't just open a front on their border to eliminate the communist army.
4 - The border you made mean a very very different italian front as Tito wanted Istria and Trieste extremely badly and already had informal agreement with the Wallies over the occupation duty, this map mean that Jugoslavia never reached Istria or that the Wallies reached it a lot before Tito and there were a different type of relations between them
5 - De Gasperi assasination, well this is big, who does it? If any communist do it well the civil war will officially begin years before and with the Wallies occupy the italian penisula meaning that the PCI/PSI will last probably a long week end before surrender
1 - sorry forgot any real boom unless on the relative term, we if lucky can become more or less rich like OTL Hungary under the communist regime and as said this is the best case scenario; no Marshall Plan and a multiyear civil war in addition of all the devastation of the second world war and an idiotic economic system...say that we will have 'le pezze al culo' will be very optimistic and this bring the second point
2 - The URSS, as the only nation that can give Italy the support that desperately and i mean really really really desperately need, well it will extract a step price, basically welcome Warsaw Pact and Comecon and this mean soviet troops in Italy and the Italian economy work for the benefit first of the new masters and later of the italian citizens and no sorry but weapons deals will not save the italian debt as it will be too high and frankly the great part of the possible client really don't have the mean to pay, Sorry but there is no way that the Soviet will accept Di Vittorio compromise, hell seem strange that he still breath and even if they don't have the mean for a regime change, well Rome can kiss goodbye to any help. The only option is to go on all four to Washington start kissing some shoes and begging some scraps pointing how not aligned and not very friendly with Moscow they are and maybe they can have a deal like Yugoslavia OTL, that will resolve a lot of problem but hardly to obtain with McArthur in charge and with Jugoslavia as already more Western friendly and not really on good terms with the italians at the moment
3 - NATO, ok i know that you have said that they have send massive help but somewhat and for some mirale (sorry but it's hard to believe), the communist had a better armed army, this bring out who is supporting them? The URSS? Ok but how, Tito? Ok but not only he also support the greeks communist and so his resources will be much more limited but we both know what is price will be. France on the other side will go to simply annex Ventimiglia and other border zone for security reason and never leave and that if they don't just open a front on their border to eliminate the communist army.
4 - The border you made mean a very very different italian front as Tito wanted Istria and Trieste extremely badly and already had informal agreement with the Wallies over the occupation duty, this map mean that Jugoslavia never reached Istria or that the Wallies reached it a lot before Tito and there were a different type of relations between them
5 - De Gasperi assasination, well this is big, who does it? If any communist do it well the civil war will officially begin years before and with the Wallies occupy the italian penisula meaning that the PCI/PSI will last probably a long week end before surrender
@lukedalton :
1. If you completely ignore the existence of OTL Cuba or the other Soviet backed regimes in Africa and Asia, your first and second point would make sense. Shit, Romania got away with a lot of indipendent actions, in spite of being part of the Warsaw Pact
2. The Soviets simply realised that the Italian ports in the Mediterrean were a worth price, especially because the other option was a new civil war ITTL. Again IRL the Soviets backed literally anyone who was hostile to the West (unless you think Nasser and Sadam were communists).
3. Originally I had envisioned a proper TL, with the POD being the assasination of the Big Three at Teheran. Basically both Istria remaining Italian and the subsequent civil war was Patton doing his best and worst.
When I turned it in a TLIAW, I simply chose another POD.
4. I literally pointed out in the prelude, I was more aiming at an original Italian TL rather than the usual cliches about a Communist Italy
5. Don't you ever get tired of saying the edact same thing in every thread? Because I still remember how you kept derailing "Red Spies in the White House".
1. If you completely ignore the existence of OTL Cuba or the other Soviet backed regimes in Africa and Asia, your first and second point would make sense. Shit, Romania got away with a lot of indipendent actions, in spite of being part of the Warsaw Pact
2. The Soviets simply realised that the Italian ports in the Mediterrean were a worth price, especially because the other option was a new civil war ITTL. Again IRL the Soviets backed literally anyone who was hostile to the West (unless you think Nasser and Sadam were communists).
3. Originally I had envisioned a proper TL, with the POD being the assasination of the Big Three at Teheran. Basically both Istria remaining Italian and the subsequent civil war was Patton doing his best and worst.
When I turned it in a TLIAW, I simply chose another POD.
4. I literally pointed out in the prelude, I was more aiming at an original Italian TL rather than the usual cliches about a Communist Italy
5. Don't you ever get tired of saying the edact same thing in every thread? Because I still remember how you kept derailing "Red Spies in the White House".
1 - to quote Good Omens 'One is a good story, two is a systemic problem', sure they tollerated Ceausescu but first he know how much he can push it and second it was surrounded by other communist nation (once things with Jugoslavia become more normal) so it was not really a frontline nation, Italy don't have this advantageand frankly Moscow will tollerate only one 'bad boy'. Cuba economy was extremely dependent on massive Soviet help and in exchange it give access not only to a nice zone to spy the americans but it also gave troops for various third world conflict (Angola and Ethiopia in primis), tryed to export the revolution and not really separate herself from moscow except for some minor thing (hell Moscow big job was to keep Castro and Che eagerness under control) and they have their military presence there and frankly the communist insurgency was nothing compared to WWII and a multi year civil war in term of devastation and need to resources for rebuilding. Regarding Asia, oh well there is Afghanistan but is not a real good example, Vietnam was a firm ally of Moscow but hardly rich and needed to keep Moscow happy due to her big problem on the north
2- Well they have already Greece so Italy utility is lessened, expecially if Sardinia and Sicily are independent and hostile and for any possible opposition honestly the moment they have troops there they will not care much about another civil war, after all what brotherly help is for if not to squash the damned reactionaies plus frankly i doubt that after WWII and the civil war there will be so much appetite for another round just after the end of one, expecially if the Soviet send much very much needed help and sure they backed litteraly anyone but first Europe is another matter, they consider it their backyard (expecially at the time) plus as a communist nation.
4 - Yeah i read, i pointed out the problem in the scenario, basically you can have it that way but it's hardly to believe not only that Italy was somewhat prosperous (even with the addition of the 'years of lead' on top of all) and that Moscow will be nice enough to treat her differently from all the other communist nation in the continent
5: in Red Spies, the communist had more influenence in a DE here De Gasperi, you know the head of the DC is KILLED point, there is a difference, if they have been the fascist is a thing, the communist/socialist is another matter as it's a thing that neither the non communist member of the CNL o more importanly the Anglo-American can accept and in 1944 they hold all the cards in a manners that not even funny as the communist partisan continue to fight only thanks to their support. Plus yes i say the same things but maybe is because is truth. In Red Spies i pointed out that well you treat the PCI and PSI (same for the PCF) like they were after the secret speech and Hungary while before they were another beast and there was another climate, maybe you don't like it but this don't make me say something of wrong.
@lukedalton:
1. LITERALLY IN THE FIRST CHAPTER, I pointed out the Reds conquered the most industrialised regions at the start of the conflict. You know the same thing that allowed Lenin to win OTL
2. The Soviets threatened to financially ruin Rome and kill a bunch of war prisoners over an article. They invaded Greece and supported terrorists to keep Longo in check. No, they aren't particularly generous towards the Second Republic
3. Why do you think there are Soviet troops in Italy? Do you think West Austria or Yugoslavia would let them pass ITTL?
4. The TL is mine, and I decide what to do. I wanted to explore an original scenario and I will do it, even if it not completely realistic
This is me being polite. Nobody is forcing you to read this TLIAW, so you can either enjoy it or leave.
Your endless complains are beyond annoying
1. LITERALLY IN THE FIRST CHAPTER, I pointed out the Reds conquered the most industrialised regions at the start of the conflict. You know the same thing that allowed Lenin to win OTL
2. The Soviets threatened to financially ruin Rome and kill a bunch of war prisoners over an article. They invaded Greece and supported terrorists to keep Longo in check. No, they aren't particularly generous towards the Second Republic
3. Why do you think there are Soviet troops in Italy? Do you think West Austria or Yugoslavia would let them pass ITTL?
4. The TL is mine, and I decide what to do. I wanted to explore an original scenario and I will do it, even if it not completely realistic
This is me being polite. Nobody is forcing you to read this TLIAW, so you can either enjoy it or leave.
Your endless complains are beyond annoying
May I suggest, adding in that light or constructive criticism is appreciated but nothing too heavy or non constructive?
Yeah, sorry I probably came across as a dick.
It is just tur guy is basically asking me to rewrite everything from scratch. Or the fact he has been acting like a broken records for months at this point
The Backstabber
GIOVANNI DE LORENZO
The Backstabber
Prior to 1948, Giovanni de Lorenzo was a decorated colonel, well known for coordinating espionage and sabotage activities in Romagna against the fascist government during WW2.
For this reason, in 1947 Scelba had entrusted him with the task of spying on Pietro Nenni, Aldo Moro, and other "subversives" who were considered a threat to the stability of the First Republic.
Just over four years after that promotion, a smiling de Lorenzo sat next to Giusepppe Di Vittorio, celebrating the defeat of Scelba and the birth of the Second Republic.
To justify his betrayal of Scelba, Giovanni de Lorenzo liked to tell how in 1943 Ivano Carpenteri, a young communist, had died protecting him from some fascist soldiers. With tears in his eyes, de Lorenzo always compared the boy's sacrifice to the divine illumination that had thunderstruck St. Paul on the road to Damascus.
That single sacrifice had prompted de Lorenzo to abandon his old prejudices against the Communists/Socialists and take up their cause.
According to this version of the story, de Lorenzo had secretly collaborated with the PCI and PSI in both civil wars, as he hoped to honor the memory of his savior.
Of course, it would have been hard to believe this melodramatic story even under normal circumstances. It was even harder to believe it in De Lorenzo's case, as the man was a textbook example of a sociopath.
Indeed, it is very likely that the mysterious Carpenteri never existed at all. In reality, de Lorenzo had betrayed Scelba's government for the same reason he had sided with the anti-Mussolini front in 1943: de Lorenzo had no intention of being on the losing side.
Between 1947 and 1948, de Lorenzo had not only realized that Scelba's paranoia was partially justified, but also that the Italian army was decidedly less united and more disorganized than Rome had thought.
Had war really broken out, it was more than likely that the National Popular Front would have emerged victorious.
Thus, de Lorenzo secretly got in touch with Togliatti and began passing valuable information to the PCI. However, it seems that de Giuliano decided to fully side with the PCI only in 1949, after the fall of Milan.
After that date, the amount of information passed to the government in Bologna definitely increased. It has also been speculated that it was de Lorenzo who informed Bologna of Scelba's decision to abandon Rome, explaining the speed with which its troops arrived in the former capital.
At the end of the conflict, de Lorenzo was promoted to general, and he was given the task of creating the new intelligence services of the Second Republic.
The new intelligence chief's first visit was to the Soviet consulate. In exchange for information and other resources useful for his political career, de Lorenzo promised to inform the Soviets about what was happening in the Quirinal.
After the Abruzzo earthquake and the beginning of the Italian Troubles, de Lorenzo was appointed as the new Minister of Internal Security. Although Longo distrusted de Lorenzo, he was convinced the Minister of Internal Security posed no danger to his government, given his unpopularity and lack of allies within the Politburo.
Unfortunately, Longo had no way of foreseeing his abduction and eventual execution.
Ironically, de Lorenzo was the only member of the Politburo who benefited from Longo's death.
In 1969, Vittorio Vitali, Minister of Ideological Integrity and de Lorenzo's main ally, persuaded Parliament that Longo's death was caused by the Politburo's indifference, and its interference in the investigation.
Hypocritically, the same parliamentarians, who a few weeks earlier had praised their refusal to negotiate, forced most of Longo's ministers to resign, allowing de Lorenzo to become the new Prime Minister.
The rise of de Lorenzo ended the relative liberalism initiated by Longo. The new Politburo was controlled by the most radical wing of the PCI, which repealed many of the previous economic and political reforms. For the first time since 1948, the PSI was excluded from the government.
Citing Longo's assassination, the new Prime Minister ordered numerous arrests (including Aldo Moro and most of the DP leaders), while increasing the funds and resources available to the ACPN. By the end of 1969 every telephone on the peninsula was under surveillance.
Under de Lorenzo, the Second Republic abandoned its traditional neutrality, and began to side more and more with the Soviet Union.
In the first six months of his government, de Lorenzo made a total of four diplomatic trips to Moscow, and the Soviet ambassador became a regular guest at the Quirinal.
According to Soviet defector Yuri Andropov, de Lorenzo was almost forced to take these measures.
Apparently Secretary General Pantelejmon Ponomarenko had threatened de Lorenzo with the reveal of his previous espionage activities on behalf of the Soviets, if the new Prime Minister had not followed Moscow's instructions to the letter.
In any case, his pro-Soviet positions were only the least of de Lorenzo's problems. While the previous twelve years had shown that de Lorenzo had an innate talent for scheming, the next two showed that he was not as adept at governing.
To begin with, the Italian economy, already fragile before de Lorenzo's rise, went into crisis following his decision to sever trade relations with Yugoslavia.
The new trade agreements with Moscow soon proved to be a disaster, as Italian industries ended up paying more for raw materials and selling their products at a much lower price.
No member of the Politburo could, of course, improve the economic situation. The ministers chosen by de Lorenzo were sycophants, appointed more for their political connections than their abilities.
However, it was not the domestic policies of de Lorenzo's government that determined its demise, but his foreign policy.
In the last months of 1969, tension between Moscow and Beijing peaked to the point that both Communist powers began to increase the number of soldiers present along the Sino-Soviet border.
Although the Second Republic had previously tried to remain neutral during the many confrontations between the Soviets and the Chinese, de Lorenzo openly sided with Moscow, accusing Chen Boda of being a warmonger and expelling much of the Chinese embassy.
De Lorenzo had acted in the belief that the crisis was going to be short-lived, and that Beijing and Moscow would reach an agreement. Unfortunately, de Lorenzo could not foresee the coup in North Korea, or how the attempted Chinese invasion of the new Soviet ally would start the Sino-Soviet War.
It did not take long before Moscow began asking members of the Stalingrad Alliance, and its other Communist allies to assist the Soviet war effort by sending assets and "volunteers."
And of course de Lorenzo was one of the first leaders to receive such request.
Upon the news that de Lorenzo was willing to send at least six divisions to China, the streets of the peninsula were rocked by numerous protests for the first time since 1948.
In addition to the normal protests, the Second Republic was hit by a new wave of terrorist attacks.
On May 18, 1970, A Maoist group detonated a bomb at Naples central station, causing the east wing of the building to collapse and killing nearly 100 people in the process.
Rome's failed attempts to cover up what happened, first blaming a gas leak and then inesistent right-wing extremist groups, further damaged de Lorenzo's popularity with the Parliament.
Once again, events in China detemined the fate of de Lorenzo. In late 1970, Taiwanese President Sun Li-jen declared war on the People's Republic of China, followed closely by President Fred Trump and British Prime Minister Julian Amery.
The Soviets and Americans actually had no diplomatic agreement regarding a potential division of mainland China. Rather, Moscow and Washington denounced the other for "violating the sovereignty of the Chinese people" with its declaration of war.
Attempts by the Second Republic media to compare what was happening to the WW2 alliances against Nazi Germany had little success.
On the contrary, mainland Italy was shaken even more by protests and strikes.
On the one hand, many Italian citizens feared that Moscow might also invade the Second Republic by allying with the government of Sicily and Sardinia.
On the other, many were convinced that a nuclear war was imminent, and therefore sought to protest the war, or looted grocery stores.
On March 15, 1971, De Lorenzo's government officially came to an end. After the nuclear destruction of Lop Nur two days earlier, the loyalty of part of the army was the only reason why Parliament had not voted to remove de Lorenzo from office.
However, during the reunion of Parliament of that day, de Lorenzo was informed that a group of protesters (including Longo's widow) was heading towards the Quirinal.
The marchers hoped to to enter Parliament, or at least force de Lorenzo to come out so they could reveal their demands against the war.
De Lorenzo, according to many witnesses under the influence of alcohol, reportedly reacted violently to the news, cursing in front of the Politburo and its deputies, while sending troops to disperse the march by any means.
In his fury, De Lorenzo did not realize that the soldiers sent against the demonstration were the same ones who would shortly be sent to fight in China.
The soldiers, already convinced that they were going to die anyway and not particularly eager to kill in the name of the increasingly unpopular de Lorenzo, decided to side with the demonstrators and accompany them toward Parliament.
De Lorenzo, terrified that this was the beginning of a popular uprising, hurriedly fled to Bologna, where the Secret Service headquarters were located.
In the hour it took De Lorenzo to arrive in Bologna, most of the parliamentarians of the Second Republic voted for his removal as Prime Minister and ordered his arrest.
Upon receiving the news, members of the Secret Service arrested De Lorenzo the very moment his helicopter landed in Bologna.
None of them were particularly eager to die for their former leader and hoped that his arrest would persuade the new government to pardon them.
De Lorenzo managed to avoid capital punishment mainly because the Second Republic government feared setting a dangerous precedent by executing a former head of state.
According to some rumors, the former Prime Minister even revealed the whereabouts of his personal archives, filled with valuable information gathered over decades of espionage, in order to avoid a too severe punishment.
De Lorenzo was then sentenced to spend the rest of his life in prison on charges of corruption and espionage.
In his particular case, the sentence ended in 1973 when the former Prime Minister killed himself (or was killed) with a poisoned coffee.
The Backstabber
Prior to 1948, Giovanni de Lorenzo was a decorated colonel, well known for coordinating espionage and sabotage activities in Romagna against the fascist government during WW2.
For this reason, in 1947 Scelba had entrusted him with the task of spying on Pietro Nenni, Aldo Moro, and other "subversives" who were considered a threat to the stability of the First Republic.
Just over four years after that promotion, a smiling de Lorenzo sat next to Giusepppe Di Vittorio, celebrating the defeat of Scelba and the birth of the Second Republic.
To justify his betrayal of Scelba, Giovanni de Lorenzo liked to tell how in 1943 Ivano Carpenteri, a young communist, had died protecting him from some fascist soldiers. With tears in his eyes, de Lorenzo always compared the boy's sacrifice to the divine illumination that had thunderstruck St. Paul on the road to Damascus.
That single sacrifice had prompted de Lorenzo to abandon his old prejudices against the Communists/Socialists and take up their cause.
According to this version of the story, de Lorenzo had secretly collaborated with the PCI and PSI in both civil wars, as he hoped to honor the memory of his savior.
Of course, it would have been hard to believe this melodramatic story even under normal circumstances. It was even harder to believe it in De Lorenzo's case, as the man was a textbook example of a sociopath.
Indeed, it is very likely that the mysterious Carpenteri never existed at all. In reality, de Lorenzo had betrayed Scelba's government for the same reason he had sided with the anti-Mussolini front in 1943: de Lorenzo had no intention of being on the losing side.
Between 1947 and 1948, de Lorenzo had not only realized that Scelba's paranoia was partially justified, but also that the Italian army was decidedly less united and more disorganized than Rome had thought.
Had war really broken out, it was more than likely that the National Popular Front would have emerged victorious.
Thus, de Lorenzo secretly got in touch with Togliatti and began passing valuable information to the PCI. However, it seems that de Giuliano decided to fully side with the PCI only in 1949, after the fall of Milan.
After that date, the amount of information passed to the government in Bologna definitely increased. It has also been speculated that it was de Lorenzo who informed Bologna of Scelba's decision to abandon Rome, explaining the speed with which its troops arrived in the former capital.
At the end of the conflict, de Lorenzo was promoted to general, and he was given the task of creating the new intelligence services of the Second Republic.
The new intelligence chief's first visit was to the Soviet consulate. In exchange for information and other resources useful for his political career, de Lorenzo promised to inform the Soviets about what was happening in the Quirinal.
After the Abruzzo earthquake and the beginning of the Italian Troubles, de Lorenzo was appointed as the new Minister of Internal Security. Although Longo distrusted de Lorenzo, he was convinced the Minister of Internal Security posed no danger to his government, given his unpopularity and lack of allies within the Politburo.
Unfortunately, Longo had no way of foreseeing his abduction and eventual execution.
Ironically, de Lorenzo was the only member of the Politburo who benefited from Longo's death.
In 1969, Vittorio Vitali, Minister of Ideological Integrity and de Lorenzo's main ally, persuaded Parliament that Longo's death was caused by the Politburo's indifference, and its interference in the investigation.
Hypocritically, the same parliamentarians, who a few weeks earlier had praised their refusal to negotiate, forced most of Longo's ministers to resign, allowing de Lorenzo to become the new Prime Minister.
The rise of de Lorenzo ended the relative liberalism initiated by Longo. The new Politburo was controlled by the most radical wing of the PCI, which repealed many of the previous economic and political reforms. For the first time since 1948, the PSI was excluded from the government.
Citing Longo's assassination, the new Prime Minister ordered numerous arrests (including Aldo Moro and most of the DP leaders), while increasing the funds and resources available to the ACPN. By the end of 1969 every telephone on the peninsula was under surveillance.
Under de Lorenzo, the Second Republic abandoned its traditional neutrality, and began to side more and more with the Soviet Union.
In the first six months of his government, de Lorenzo made a total of four diplomatic trips to Moscow, and the Soviet ambassador became a regular guest at the Quirinal.
According to Soviet defector Yuri Andropov, de Lorenzo was almost forced to take these measures.
Apparently Secretary General Pantelejmon Ponomarenko had threatened de Lorenzo with the reveal of his previous espionage activities on behalf of the Soviets, if the new Prime Minister had not followed Moscow's instructions to the letter.
In any case, his pro-Soviet positions were only the least of de Lorenzo's problems. While the previous twelve years had shown that de Lorenzo had an innate talent for scheming, the next two showed that he was not as adept at governing.
To begin with, the Italian economy, already fragile before de Lorenzo's rise, went into crisis following his decision to sever trade relations with Yugoslavia.
The new trade agreements with Moscow soon proved to be a disaster, as Italian industries ended up paying more for raw materials and selling their products at a much lower price.
No member of the Politburo could, of course, improve the economic situation. The ministers chosen by de Lorenzo were sycophants, appointed more for their political connections than their abilities.
However, it was not the domestic policies of de Lorenzo's government that determined its demise, but his foreign policy.
In the last months of 1969, tension between Moscow and Beijing peaked to the point that both Communist powers began to increase the number of soldiers present along the Sino-Soviet border.
Although the Second Republic had previously tried to remain neutral during the many confrontations between the Soviets and the Chinese, de Lorenzo openly sided with Moscow, accusing Chen Boda of being a warmonger and expelling much of the Chinese embassy.
De Lorenzo had acted in the belief that the crisis was going to be short-lived, and that Beijing and Moscow would reach an agreement. Unfortunately, de Lorenzo could not foresee the coup in North Korea, or how the attempted Chinese invasion of the new Soviet ally would start the Sino-Soviet War.
It did not take long before Moscow began asking members of the Stalingrad Alliance, and its other Communist allies to assist the Soviet war effort by sending assets and "volunteers."
And of course de Lorenzo was one of the first leaders to receive such request.
Upon the news that de Lorenzo was willing to send at least six divisions to China, the streets of the peninsula were rocked by numerous protests for the first time since 1948.
In addition to the normal protests, the Second Republic was hit by a new wave of terrorist attacks.
On May 18, 1970, A Maoist group detonated a bomb at Naples central station, causing the east wing of the building to collapse and killing nearly 100 people in the process.
Rome's failed attempts to cover up what happened, first blaming a gas leak and then inesistent right-wing extremist groups, further damaged de Lorenzo's popularity with the Parliament.
Once again, events in China detemined the fate of de Lorenzo. In late 1970, Taiwanese President Sun Li-jen declared war on the People's Republic of China, followed closely by President Fred Trump and British Prime Minister Julian Amery.
The Soviets and Americans actually had no diplomatic agreement regarding a potential division of mainland China. Rather, Moscow and Washington denounced the other for "violating the sovereignty of the Chinese people" with its declaration of war.
Attempts by the Second Republic media to compare what was happening to the WW2 alliances against Nazi Germany had little success.
On the contrary, mainland Italy was shaken even more by protests and strikes.
On the one hand, many Italian citizens feared that Moscow might also invade the Second Republic by allying with the government of Sicily and Sardinia.
On the other, many were convinced that a nuclear war was imminent, and therefore sought to protest the war, or looted grocery stores.
On March 15, 1971, De Lorenzo's government officially came to an end. After the nuclear destruction of Lop Nur two days earlier, the loyalty of part of the army was the only reason why Parliament had not voted to remove de Lorenzo from office.
However, during the reunion of Parliament of that day, de Lorenzo was informed that a group of protesters (including Longo's widow) was heading towards the Quirinal.
The marchers hoped to to enter Parliament, or at least force de Lorenzo to come out so they could reveal their demands against the war.
De Lorenzo, according to many witnesses under the influence of alcohol, reportedly reacted violently to the news, cursing in front of the Politburo and its deputies, while sending troops to disperse the march by any means.
In his fury, De Lorenzo did not realize that the soldiers sent against the demonstration were the same ones who would shortly be sent to fight in China.
The soldiers, already convinced that they were going to die anyway and not particularly eager to kill in the name of the increasingly unpopular de Lorenzo, decided to side with the demonstrators and accompany them toward Parliament.
De Lorenzo, terrified that this was the beginning of a popular uprising, hurriedly fled to Bologna, where the Secret Service headquarters were located.
In the hour it took De Lorenzo to arrive in Bologna, most of the parliamentarians of the Second Republic voted for his removal as Prime Minister and ordered his arrest.
Upon receiving the news, members of the Secret Service arrested De Lorenzo the very moment his helicopter landed in Bologna.
None of them were particularly eager to die for their former leader and hoped that his arrest would persuade the new government to pardon them.
De Lorenzo managed to avoid capital punishment mainly because the Second Republic government feared setting a dangerous precedent by executing a former head of state.
According to some rumors, the former Prime Minister even revealed the whereabouts of his personal archives, filled with valuable information gathered over decades of espionage, in order to avoid a too severe punishment.
De Lorenzo was then sentenced to spend the rest of his life in prison on charges of corruption and espionage.
In his particular case, the sentence ended in 1973 when the former Prime Minister killed himself (or was killed) with a poisoned coffee.
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After a bit of criticism, I changed the POD from De Gasperi being murdered in 1944 to him beimg executed by the fascist in 1943.
OTL he had to drop everything and run after the German invasion. ITTL he is not so lucky and the Salo government decided to male an example out of it.
I am still keeping Istria as part of Italy through. I just like the ahistorical irony of the Aosta Valley and Istria switching fates, resulting in this mess.
OTL he had to drop everything and run after the German invasion. ITTL he is not so lucky and the Salo government decided to male an example out of it.
I am still keeping Istria as part of Italy through. I just like the ahistorical irony of the Aosta Valley and Istria switching fates, resulting in this mess.
Don't keep changing it for the criticism; everyone's a critique, they'll find something else to nitpick. Write the story you'd like to read not what they'd like to read.
Thanks I appreciate the support. I simply changed the POD because it made a bit more sense.
And yes, the dude basically asked me to rewrite everything from scratch so of course I am ignoring him over everything else.
The Liberal Stalinist
PIETRO INGRAO
The liberal Stalinist
In many European and American history books, little space is devoted to what the Italian government did between 1971 and 1975. Pietro Ingrao’s four-year rule is considered far less important than other events of the same period, such as Chen Boda’s nuclear suicide in Beijing or the beginning of the military dictatorship in England.
Many even ignore that, in this period, the Italian peninsula was led by a transitional government, or the large number of reforms approved in these four years. At best, Ingrao is remembered as a simple bureaucrat, who transitioned the Italian peninsula from the Second to the Third Republic.
Yet, this is a huge oversimplification for a man that in end practically saved Italy from a third civil war.
The end of the government of De Lorenzo had in no way improved the internal situation of the peninsula. Martial law was still in force in many cities, due to rampant violence and chaos, and numerous troops were said to be on the verge of mutiny.
A lot of citizens had begun to lose confidence in the system. Shortly after the arrest of de Lorenzo, in fact, rumors began to circulate that the leader of the peninsula had actually worked for years on behalf of the Soviets.
It is in these circumstances that Parliament voted Pietro Ingrao, the almost sixty years old former Minister of Education of the previous government, as the new Prime Minister.
Ingrao's life reflected alost perfectly the political evolution of the Italian Peninsula throught the previous three decades. Ingrao had been raised in an environment devout to Mussolini, but Stalin had replaced Il Duce in his heart after he had started high school.
For almost two decades, Ingrao had vocally supported Moscow to the point he had accused the Bulgarian Uprising of being a fascist plot.
Yet, the mysterious death of Longo and de Lorenzo's increasing brutality had driven him to abandon his old devotion.
Although Ingrao was well known for his uncompromising ideological positions, the new Prime Minister enjoyed the support of much of Parliament. On the one hand, the more conservative parliamentarians liked Ingrao both for his opposition to Longo’s economic reforms and for his importance as a propagandist between 1948 and 1969.
On the other hand, the Liberals appreciated him for being the only member of De Lorenzo’s Politburo to vote for the removal of the former Prime Minister, and his many ideas about a possible liberalization of the political institutions on the peninsula.
In addition, many Members of Parliament were reassured that the reforms proposed by Ingrao aimed at the creation of an interparliamentary democracy, not a genuine one. According to Ingrao, Parliament should have been the most important political body in the new republic, and only members of the National Popular Front should have continued to control it.
Ingrao was, in any case, a compromise candidate, representing the Parliament while the Institutional Reform Committee amended the 1953 Constitution.
But Ingrao assumed his institutional role with considerable vigour. The new Prime Minister was the first Communist leader in history to officially admit that his predecessors had made serious mistakes, and that it was necessary to reform the system. As a demonstration, the new Prime Minister ordered the immediate release of Aldo Moro and the other leaders of the DP.
Given the nature of his speech, readers will not be surprised that Ingrao’s four-year rule is known as "The Time of Reforms and Trials" in much of continental Italy.
First, Ingrao managed to move the country from the Second to the Third Republic, reforming the 1953 constitution to eliminate the risk of another institutional crisis.
Parliament was greatly strengthened by the weakening of the powers of the Prime Minister and his Politburo. Parliamentary elections were to be held every four years, after which Parliament would have to vote on whether to grant the Prime Minister a further term, or to replace him.
Parliament would also have the final say in the selection of Politburo members. While the Prime Minister still had to choose his ministers, their appointment had to be confirmed by the majority of Parliament.
Ingrao also moved to limit the powers of the secret police. The ACPN was dissolved, and replaced by the much less powerful Servizi Interni di Sicurezza (Internal Security Services).
Unlike their predecessor, the SIS was not managed by a single minister, but was under the control of both the Ministry of Defence and the Prime Minister. To prevent another De Lorenzo, the Ministry of Internal Security was abolished. At the same time it was established that the head of the SIS could not run for Prime Minister, nor hold any other political position aftewards.
Like his predecessors, the reforms of Ingrao were accompanied by a new purge. De Lorenzo’s confessions had, in fact, started the Red Hands scandal.
According to the former Prime Minister, the Soviets had already infiltrated most of the institutions of the Italian peninsula. Many MPs, and military commanders had agreed to pass information, and hold pro-Soviet political positions, in exchange for gifts and large sums of money.
According to this confession, these parliamentarians and members of the military would have let numerous terrorist attacks happen to influence the government of the peninsula and to prevent it from leaving the Soviet sphere of influence.
Under the direction of Minister of Propaganda Mike Buongiorno, most of the subsequent trials were broadcast and heavily promoted on every Italian television. For almost three years, frightened politicians and tearful generals admitted their alleged crimes, taking responsibility for everything that was wrong in the Second Republic. Some of the accused preferred to flee to the Soviets rather than risk a trial, while others just decided that suicide was a better alternative.
It is possible that the whole scandal was just a setup, aimed at creating scapegoats to blame for the problems and instability of the peninsula. However, Ingrao also ordered the arrest of some of his political allies, apparently involved in the scandal.
Moreover, many trials were not shown on television, because apparently the government feared what the confessions were going to reveal.
Even if we will never know the truth, it is undeniable that the actions of the government produced the desired results. By the end of 1974, the protests and violence had almost completely disappeared, apart from the occasional terrorist attacks, and the population had returned to partially trust the government.
In the end, Ingrao’s government collapsed because of his ideological intransigence regarding the economy. Although the Prime Minister recognized the need to reform the political institutions of the peninsula, he was still convinced that its economic structure should have followed Marxist ideals to the letter.
For this reason, the Third Republic was completely taken aback by the global economic crisis caused by the nuclear destruction of Beijing. If Ingrao had agreed to at least partially liberalise the Italian economy in previous years, perhaps the Third Republic would not have been particularly affected.
But Ingrao had done nothing, and so the Italian lira ended up being almost useless paper.
It was not long before his opponents in Parliament began to attack Ingrao because of the difficult economic situation. Many of his former supporters also wanted to use him as a scapegoat, or simply wanted a new government, believing the Commission had finished its work.
In early 1975, Giorgio Amendola, Minister of the Treasury, and Manlio Brosio, Minister of Foreign Affairs, resigned to protest against the government’s economic policies. According to the rules established by Ingrao himself, their deputies should have been approved by Parliament, but most of its members did not want to cooperate in any way with the Prime Minister.
Ingrao could then start a long clash with the legislative body, which he himself had strengthened, or resign, indicating the potential successor he preferred.
On 19 March 1975, Ingrao agreed to resign, after he was assured that he would remain director of L’Unità and member of Parliament.
In later years Ingrao became more famous as a writer than a politician. While Ingrao was soon politically labelled an old hyper-conservative fossil, he also gained considerable fame for his essays and poems. When Ingrao died in 2015, the former Prime Minister was now better known as a writer and poet than as the reformer of the entire political system of continental Italy.
The liberal Stalinist
In many European and American history books, little space is devoted to what the Italian government did between 1971 and 1975. Pietro Ingrao’s four-year rule is considered far less important than other events of the same period, such as Chen Boda’s nuclear suicide in Beijing or the beginning of the military dictatorship in England.
Many even ignore that, in this period, the Italian peninsula was led by a transitional government, or the large number of reforms approved in these four years. At best, Ingrao is remembered as a simple bureaucrat, who transitioned the Italian peninsula from the Second to the Third Republic.
Yet, this is a huge oversimplification for a man that in end practically saved Italy from a third civil war.
The end of the government of De Lorenzo had in no way improved the internal situation of the peninsula. Martial law was still in force in many cities, due to rampant violence and chaos, and numerous troops were said to be on the verge of mutiny.
A lot of citizens had begun to lose confidence in the system. Shortly after the arrest of de Lorenzo, in fact, rumors began to circulate that the leader of the peninsula had actually worked for years on behalf of the Soviets.
It is in these circumstances that Parliament voted Pietro Ingrao, the almost sixty years old former Minister of Education of the previous government, as the new Prime Minister.
Ingrao's life reflected alost perfectly the political evolution of the Italian Peninsula throught the previous three decades. Ingrao had been raised in an environment devout to Mussolini, but Stalin had replaced Il Duce in his heart after he had started high school.
For almost two decades, Ingrao had vocally supported Moscow to the point he had accused the Bulgarian Uprising of being a fascist plot.
Yet, the mysterious death of Longo and de Lorenzo's increasing brutality had driven him to abandon his old devotion.
Although Ingrao was well known for his uncompromising ideological positions, the new Prime Minister enjoyed the support of much of Parliament. On the one hand, the more conservative parliamentarians liked Ingrao both for his opposition to Longo’s economic reforms and for his importance as a propagandist between 1948 and 1969.
On the other hand, the Liberals appreciated him for being the only member of De Lorenzo’s Politburo to vote for the removal of the former Prime Minister, and his many ideas about a possible liberalization of the political institutions on the peninsula.
In addition, many Members of Parliament were reassured that the reforms proposed by Ingrao aimed at the creation of an interparliamentary democracy, not a genuine one. According to Ingrao, Parliament should have been the most important political body in the new republic, and only members of the National Popular Front should have continued to control it.
Ingrao was, in any case, a compromise candidate, representing the Parliament while the Institutional Reform Committee amended the 1953 Constitution.
But Ingrao assumed his institutional role with considerable vigour. The new Prime Minister was the first Communist leader in history to officially admit that his predecessors had made serious mistakes, and that it was necessary to reform the system. As a demonstration, the new Prime Minister ordered the immediate release of Aldo Moro and the other leaders of the DP.
Given the nature of his speech, readers will not be surprised that Ingrao’s four-year rule is known as "The Time of Reforms and Trials" in much of continental Italy.
First, Ingrao managed to move the country from the Second to the Third Republic, reforming the 1953 constitution to eliminate the risk of another institutional crisis.
Parliament was greatly strengthened by the weakening of the powers of the Prime Minister and his Politburo. Parliamentary elections were to be held every four years, after which Parliament would have to vote on whether to grant the Prime Minister a further term, or to replace him.
Parliament would also have the final say in the selection of Politburo members. While the Prime Minister still had to choose his ministers, their appointment had to be confirmed by the majority of Parliament.
Ingrao also moved to limit the powers of the secret police. The ACPN was dissolved, and replaced by the much less powerful Servizi Interni di Sicurezza (Internal Security Services).
Unlike their predecessor, the SIS was not managed by a single minister, but was under the control of both the Ministry of Defence and the Prime Minister. To prevent another De Lorenzo, the Ministry of Internal Security was abolished. At the same time it was established that the head of the SIS could not run for Prime Minister, nor hold any other political position aftewards.
Like his predecessors, the reforms of Ingrao were accompanied by a new purge. De Lorenzo’s confessions had, in fact, started the Red Hands scandal.
According to the former Prime Minister, the Soviets had already infiltrated most of the institutions of the Italian peninsula. Many MPs, and military commanders had agreed to pass information, and hold pro-Soviet political positions, in exchange for gifts and large sums of money.
According to this confession, these parliamentarians and members of the military would have let numerous terrorist attacks happen to influence the government of the peninsula and to prevent it from leaving the Soviet sphere of influence.
Under the direction of Minister of Propaganda Mike Buongiorno, most of the subsequent trials were broadcast and heavily promoted on every Italian television. For almost three years, frightened politicians and tearful generals admitted their alleged crimes, taking responsibility for everything that was wrong in the Second Republic. Some of the accused preferred to flee to the Soviets rather than risk a trial, while others just decided that suicide was a better alternative.
It is possible that the whole scandal was just a setup, aimed at creating scapegoats to blame for the problems and instability of the peninsula. However, Ingrao also ordered the arrest of some of his political allies, apparently involved in the scandal.
Moreover, many trials were not shown on television, because apparently the government feared what the confessions were going to reveal.
Even if we will never know the truth, it is undeniable that the actions of the government produced the desired results. By the end of 1974, the protests and violence had almost completely disappeared, apart from the occasional terrorist attacks, and the population had returned to partially trust the government.
In the end, Ingrao’s government collapsed because of his ideological intransigence regarding the economy. Although the Prime Minister recognized the need to reform the political institutions of the peninsula, he was still convinced that its economic structure should have followed Marxist ideals to the letter.
For this reason, the Third Republic was completely taken aback by the global economic crisis caused by the nuclear destruction of Beijing. If Ingrao had agreed to at least partially liberalise the Italian economy in previous years, perhaps the Third Republic would not have been particularly affected.
But Ingrao had done nothing, and so the Italian lira ended up being almost useless paper.
It was not long before his opponents in Parliament began to attack Ingrao because of the difficult economic situation. Many of his former supporters also wanted to use him as a scapegoat, or simply wanted a new government, believing the Commission had finished its work.
In early 1975, Giorgio Amendola, Minister of the Treasury, and Manlio Brosio, Minister of Foreign Affairs, resigned to protest against the government’s economic policies. According to the rules established by Ingrao himself, their deputies should have been approved by Parliament, but most of its members did not want to cooperate in any way with the Prime Minister.
Ingrao could then start a long clash with the legislative body, which he himself had strengthened, or resign, indicating the potential successor he preferred.
On 19 March 1975, Ingrao agreed to resign, after he was assured that he would remain director of L’Unità and member of Parliament.
In later years Ingrao became more famous as a writer than a politician. While Ingrao was soon politically labelled an old hyper-conservative fossil, he also gained considerable fame for his essays and poems. When Ingrao died in 2015, the former Prime Minister was now better known as a writer and poet than as the reformer of the entire political system of continental Italy.
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The mentions of events outside Italy are intriguing. So what is Italian culture like after Ingrao? Is there an rebellious or youth movement against authority with music and art? Underground films?
BUTTERFLIES! ITTL Bongiorno remained in Turin after WW2, and started working for various left-wing newspapers.Mike Bongiorno only obtained Italian citizenship quite late in his OTL life, but it's likely he would've done so much earlier under other circumstances, cool detail.I wonder how does the Bongiorno-less television landscape of Italy look like.
He was arrested by Scelba's government at the start of the Second Civil War, but was freed at the beginning of 1950.
Going back to the US wasn't an option so he started a new career in the Second/Third Republic. He obtained Italian citizenship under Longo, thanks to his coverage of the Abruzzo Earthquake.
He got arrested again under de Lorenzo, but he got freed and had a new job as minister after the previous one throw himself under a bus.
Also he is still influencing Italian Television, albeit there are less game shoews ITTL. Luckily Pietro Angela is still doing documentaries in this TL.
Thanks. I wanted to make the TL more realistic while showing how events outside Rome's control influence its political life.
Without the war in China, de Lorenzo could have stayed in power for decades and turned Mainland Italy in a worse East Germany.
It will be the focus of the next chapter
It depends on the region. In Lombardy and Piedmont, youth have developed a bizarre love for French culture almost as a rejection of the government's official line about the Aosta Valley. It helps that the French Fourth Republic is more liberal than the rest of the Continent.
In South Italy, counter-culture is centered around religion, with Jesus having been turned into a weird anarchist/rock and roll symbol.
Gianni Morandi is the symbol of said counterculture, thanks to this TL's version of ""C'era un ragazzo che come me amava i Beatles e i Rolling Stones"
Tecnically it is about the war in China, and the other post-colonial conflicts. However the name of the characters are all italians, and it is basically a criticism againt Rome's romantic depiction of the Second Italian Civil War.
The government doesn't like the counterculture one bit, so a lot of famous Italian singers of this period are either in prison or chilling in France.