Ancient Egypt survives to this day

Any chance of this TL being revived? It was very interesting.

Perhaps we could have the Sassanids spread into India. Also, we might have the Romans start to expand around the Kingdom of the Bosporus, in present day Ukraine, as we were talking about utilizing the area for grain a few posts back.

As for discovering the New World, I have to say that I don't think that Egypt would be the ones to do it. They're basicly situated on the middle of the world's trade routes, with direct access to everyone in Eurasia. They've got no real reason to send out expeditions that would find the New World. I'd expect either the Romans or the Chinese to be the ones to discover it. This doesn't preclude the Egyptians settling there, of course. With their position in Africa (they'll probably continue to expand along the coast, right?) they do have easy access to South America. We might see the Romans (or whoever comes after them) settling in Mexico and eastern North America, the Egyptians in South America, and the Chinese in western North America.

Just a thought, of course. Anyway, its a great TL. If you want any help (especially if it involved Rome surviving the barbarian incursions, hinthint), I'd be happy to assist. :D
 
DominusNovus said:
Any chance of this TL being revived? It was very interesting.

Perhaps we could have the Sassanids spread into India. Also, we might have the Romans start to expand around the Kingdom of the Bosporus, in present day Ukraine, as we were talking about utilizing the area for grain a few posts back.

As for discovering the New World, I have to say that I don't think that Egypt would be the ones to do it. They're basicly situated on the middle of the world's trade routes, with direct access to everyone in Eurasia. They've got no real reason to send out expeditions that would find the New World. I'd expect either the Romans or the Chinese to be the ones to discover it. This doesn't preclude the Egyptians settling there, of course. With their position in Africa (they'll probably continue to expand along the coast, right?) they do have easy access to South America. We might see the Romans (or whoever comes after them) settling in Mexico and eastern North America, the Egyptians in South America, and the Chinese in western North America.

Just a thought, of course. Anyway, its a great TL. If you want any help (especially if it involved Rome surviving the barbarian incursions, hinthint), I'd be happy to assist. :D

Thank you for the kind words...I am working on another installment, but unfortunately my life of late has been rather hectic so I haven't had much time to devote to it. But I do intend to carry it forward to the present day.

You are right that Egypt will not discover the New World. They will, however, send ships there after it is discovered (as mentioned in the King List). I have not decided if they will actually colonize or just trade.
 
SAITE TIMELINE, 225 to 700 AD

227--Mani, a Persian mystic born near Babylon in 215 AD, and who has
remained in Mesopotamia after the region passed into the control of Egypt, has the first of two visions which will lead him to found the religion of Manichaeism.

229-238 AD--King Ardashir I of Persia declares war on Rome in 229 AD. Egypt
remains neutral, but secretly finances both sides, which results in a protracted war which is exhausting for both empires, but inconclusive.

230 AD--Pharaoh Psamtik XII dies, succeeded by Ahmosi VI.

240-260 AD--During the period of peace between Rome and Persia, Rome
expands it’s holdings in Europe at the expense of it’s barbarian neighbors.
Roman armies push the borders of the empire to the line of the Vistula and Bug rivers, and also take the Crimea and the region north of it in the southern
Ukraine.

241 AD--Mani has his second vision and begins preaching in Mesopotamia. Over the next few decades Mani will travel throughout both the Egyptian and Persian Empires, and his new religion will gain many followers. In Egypt it becomes simply one among many competing faiths, all tolerated by the Empire, and never becomes a threat to the established State religion. However, in Persia, Mani comes into conflict with the priesthood of the official Zoroastrian state religion.

241-250 AD--War between Persia and Egypt. King Shapur I invades
Mesopotamia in 241. Egyptian forces are defeated in 242 outside Babylon, and Mesopotamia falls to Persia. Shapur follows up with yearly invasions of the Egyptian holdings in Syria and Palestine, but the Egyptians are successful in holding these areas. A treaty of peace is finally signed in 250 AD.

258-260 AD--Shapur I of Persia invades Armenia, sparking war with Rome.
Roman Emperor Valerian is defeated and captured in battle in 260 AD, and
Armenia falls to the Sassanids. Egypt is still recovering from it’s recent war with Persia, and remains neutral.

271 AD--King Shapur I of Persia dies, the Sassanid Empire experiences a period of dynastic struggle and is thus self-absorbed for a while . Relative peace reignsin the rest of the Middle East. Also in this year, Mani, who with the death of Shapur I has lost his protector, is crucified in Persia. The new King, Bahram I, severely persecutes Mani’s followers.

275 AD--Pharaoh Ahmosi VI dies, succeeded by Ahmosi VII.

280-320 AD--Expansion of Egyptian holdings in Africa. Over the previous
centuries, Egyptian settlers had gradually drifted west from Egypt’s coastal
holdings, and a large area of the African interior had come under the cultural, if not the political, domination of Egypt. Ahmosi VII decides to make that
domination political as well, and his policy is continued by his successors, Necho XII and Thutmoses VII. Egyptian armies push westward from the coast. The various petty kingdoms of the interior fall to the might of Egyptian arms, and a force of Egyptian marines conquers Madagascar. Thus, by 320 AD, the Pharaohs have added significantly to their realm. With these new conquests come new resources, such as diamonds and exotic woods, spices, animals, ivory, and many others. Egypt’s wealth reaches unprecedented levels.

290 AD--Pharaoh Ahmosi VII dies, succeeded by Necho XII.

GENERAL RELIGIOUS DEVELOPMENTS, 300-600 AD: Christianity continues to grow, especially in the Roman Empire, where it is gradually besting it’s main rivals, the cults of Mithra and of Isis, and will eventually become the state religion. In Egypt, it continues to be integrated into the native Egyptian religion, and by 400 AD is virtually unrecognizable by Christians in other lands. Indeed, various synods and councils over the course of the next few centuries will declare the Church of Egypt to be heretical, effectively casting Egyptian Christians out of the fold of Christianity. Meanwhile, Manichaeism also continues to grow, spreading to India, China, and the Roman Empire. In Rome, it is at first tolerated, but eventually will be persecuted (especially after Christianity becomes the State religion) with such severity that it will eventually be exterminated. The rulers of Persia continue to persecute the Manichaens, and as a result the religion does not flourish there, either. Egypt, with it’s tolerant policies, is another matter. Large Manichaean communities arise, but as with Christianity, they never become large enough a factor to threaten the state religion. However, it is in Egypt where Manichaeism survives to the present day, having been exterminated in all other places where it once took root.

304 AD--Pharaoh Necho XII dies, succeeded by Thutmoses VIII.

311 AD--Constantine I defeats his rivals and becomes Emperor of Rome. He
converts to Christianity soon afterward, and makes it the official religion of the Roman Empire.

333 AD--Pharaoh Thutmoses VIII is overthrown by a descendant of Wahibre II
(“the Usurper”), who takes the throne as Wahibre III, restoring the 29th Dynasty. Wahibre III ruthlessly hunts down and slays all the remaining members of the family of the 28th Dynasty who he can find, earning the name “Bloody Hand.”

337-370--Period of intermittent warfare between Sassanid Persia, Rome and
Egypt. Wars are inconclusive, but exhausting for all powers concerned.

340-363--The Great Persecution of the Christian church by King Shapur II of the Sassanid Persian Empire, who is a devout and evangelical Zoroastrian.

350 AD--Pharaoh Wahibre III dies, succeeded by Ahmosi VIII. Ahmosi VIII,
however, is killed in battle against the Persians later that same year, and is
succeeded by Wahibre IV.

360 AD--Julian “the Apostate” becomes Emperor of Rome, revokes Christianity’s official status within the Empire and attempts to revive paganism. Christians are persecuted.

363 AD--Roman Emperor Julian “the Apostate” is killed in battle with Persia. His successor, Jovian, continues the persecution of Christians.

364 AD--Emperor Jovian is overthrown by Valentinian, who becomes Emperor
Valentinian I. Christianity is restored as the official religion of Rome.
Persecutions of Christians end.

376AD--Huns, led by Uldin, reach the Black Sea and the Danube, conquering the eastern Goths. They also eject the Romans from their lands north of the Black Sea.

380-399--Persecution of Christians in the Sassanid Persian Empire by Kings
Ardashir II, Shapur II, and Bahram IV.

395AD--the Huns raid Armenia.

396 AD--Wahibre II’s attempt to eradicate the old dynasty was not totally
successful, and a line descended from a distant cousin of Thutmoses VIII still
lives in Sais. This family rises in revolt against Wahibre III, and overthrows him. Wahibre and his entire family are put to death. The new family takes power as the 30th Dynasty. The new king takes the royal name of Necho XII.

399 AD--King Yazdagird I of Sassanid Persia ascends the throne. Persecutions of Christians end.

408 AD--Pharaoh Necho XII dies, succeeded by Necho XIII. Also in this year,
King Uldin and the Huns raid into Roman Territory. They cross the Danube but
are defeated by Rome. However, Rome is forced back to it’s fortifications on the lines of the Vistula and the Danube. All territories east of the Vistula and north of the Danube are lost to the Huns.

409--Yazdagird I of Persia issues an Edict of Toleration for Christians, permitting them to publicly worship and build churches.

412AD--the new Hun leader Donatus is murdered by the Romans and is
succeeded by Charato (Karaton), who unifies all Western Huns.

416-420---Yazdagird I of Persia revokes his Edict of Toleration, persecutions of Christians begin again. Many Christians flee to Egyptian and Roman territories.

420 AD--Pharaoh Necho XIII dies, succeeded by Necho XIV.

420-427--The White Huns (an Indo-Iranian tribe from Central Asia not related to the Mongolian Huns which are at this time troubling Europe) raid Persia as far west as modern Tehran. They are severely defeated and forced to retreat from Persia by King Bahram V in 427 AD. Beginning of a long period of struggle between Sassanid Persia and these nomads from central Asia.

425AD--Huns are hired by a western Roman general (Aetius) to fight in Italy
during a political crisis.

430AD--The new Hun leader Rugida (Rua) signs a peace treaty with the eastern Roman empire (annual salary in return for peace). The Huns permanently establish themselves in Dacia (OTL Romania).

434 AD--Rugida (Rua) dies and is succeeded by Attila (a friend of Aetius) and
his brother Bleda.

437 AD--Pharaoh Necho XIV dies, succeeded by Seti VII.

441AD--The Huns raid Roman outposts along the Danube. Later that year, the Huns sign a peace treaty with the Roman Empire

445AD--By murdering his brother, Attila becomes sole leader of the Huns.

447AD--The Huns and their vassals, the Goths, attack the Roman empire in the Balkans. They break through the Danube defenses and cause extensive
damage.

448 AD onward---Christianity is again persecuted in the Sassanid Persian
Empire.

449AD--Attila signs a new treaty with the Roman Empire.

450AD--The new Roman Emperor Marcian reneges on the Hun-Roman treaty.

451AD--Huns attack the Danube fortifications but are held at the frontier by
Aetius. A new treaty is signed, and the Huns retreat to Dacia, where they collect a yearly tribute from Rome.

453AD--Attila dies. After his death, the Huns are never again much of a threat. By 500 AD they have basically amalgamated with the Goths and settled down in Dacia to stay.

454--Sassanid Persians are defeated by the White Huns. However, the White
Huns are not able to make any significant territorial gains.

457-459--Civil War in the Sassanid Empire. King Yazdagird II faces rebellion by Prince Peroz, who has allied himself with the White Huns. Peroz overthrows Yazdagird and takes the throne in 459.

464-475--White Huns attempt to overthrow King Peroz of Persia, but after a
decade of exhausting war, are finally persuaded to withdraw from Persia in
exchange for a large tribute. An uneasy peace will reign for the next few years.

484--Peroz attacks the White Huns, and is killed in battle. Sassanid Persia is
invaded by the White Huns in the aftermath of this defeat, and most of it is
conquered. The White Huns will rule Persia through puppet Sassanian Kings for the next 40 years.

500 AD--Pharaoh Seti VII dies, succeeded by Thutmoses IX.

520-531 AD--King Khusro I of Persia, in alliance with Turkish tribes from Central Asia, makes war on the White Huns, finally defeating them and re-establishing full independence.

533 AD--Pharaoh Thutmoses IX dies, succeeded by Rameses XIX.

540-562--War between Rome and Sassanid Persia.

552 AD--Pharaoh Rameses XIX dies, succeeded by Psamtik XIII

558 AD: the Avars (another Hunnic tribe from Central Asia) invade the Russian
steppes and push the Slavs to the west. Within a few years, these Slavic
refugees begin attacking the Roman fortifications on the Vistula and Danube.
Most settle in Dacia, where they amalgamate with the Huns and Goths currently living there.

560 AD: the Roman Emperor Justinian hires the Avars to fight the Huns and
Slavs. The Avars conquer Dacia, and like the Huns before them, settle there.

568 AD: the Avars attempt an invasion of Roman Territory, but are unable to get past the strong fortifications and naval patrols on the Danube. 590 AD: the empire of the Avars extends from the Volga to the Danube to the Baltic Sea.

570 AD--Pharaoh Psamtik XIII dies, succeeded by Psamtik XIV.

571 AD--Mohammed born in Arabia. Also in this year, the Roman Empire signs
a treaty with the Avars. The Avars now control an area extending from the
Roman frontier on the Danube and Vistula lines to the Volga and the Black Sea.

584: Kubrat unifies the Bulgars (a Turkic vassal tribe of the Avars, living in the
region of the southern Ukraine and Crimea). They revolt and establish their
independence from the Avars.

596 AD--Pharaoh Psamtik XIV dies, succeeded by Rameses XX.

599--The Avars defeat a Roman army in battle, capturing 12,000 prisoners,
which they execute. The Avars get past the Danube fortifications and into the Balkans, where they cause extensive damage before they are finally defeated and forced to retreat back to Dacia.

603-630 AD--Period of warfare between Rome, Persia, and Egypt. Wars are
inconclusive, but severely deplete the resources of all three powers. They are thus ill-prepared for the onslaught of the new enemy which is rising to the south, in Arabia.

626 AD--War between Rome and the Avars. The Avars are unable to breach the Danube lines, and accept a Roman peace offer. This will prove to be the last major incursion by the Avars against Roman Territory.

610-634 AD--Mohammed founds the new religion of Islam. The Muslims (as
Mohammed’s followers are called) gradually, through a series of wars, bring the entire Arabian peninsula under their control.

615 AD--Pharaoh Rameses XX dies, succeeded by Ahmosi IX.

632 AD--Death of Mohammed. Hadrat Abu Bakr becomes Caliph.

634---Omar ibn l-Khattab becomes Caliph, founding the Ommayad dynasty.
Also in this year, a Greek scientist working in the city of Naukratis (Greek colony city in Egypt), while experimenting with petroleum, sulfur, and other
inflammables, discovers a liquid substance that adheres to surfaces, ignites
upon contact, burns fiercely, and cannot be extinguished by water alone. The scientist has also invented a pumping machine, which enables the mixture to be projected in streams nearly 100 feet long. He demonstrates his discovery to Pharaoh Ahmosi, who recognizes it’s potential as a weapon. He orders Egyptian navy vessels and fortifications to be equipped with projectors for the new substance, which will come to be called “Egyptian Fire.”

634-700--Period of Muslim expansion. Muslim invasions of Syria, Mesopotamia,
Palestine, and other surrounding regions. Egypt loses it’s Asian possessions to
the Muslims, but in 642 AD the Arabs are stopped at the Suez fortifications
(where the Egyptian Fire makes its first dramatic appearance in warfare) and are unable to advance into Africa via land, while the Egyptian navy (also equipped with Egyptian Fire) keeps them from crossing by sea, either. Rome is able, with great difficulty, to hold them out of most of Asia Minor. Thwarted in the west by Rome and Egypt, the Arabs move east, where the Sassanid Persians are not so lucky, their empire falling to a wave of Arab invaders by 650 AD. The Muslims continue to move East, expanding into central Asia and over-running most of the Indian subcontinent by 700 AD. They also move north, taking most of the Caucasus region.

650--The Bulgars are driven westward by the Khazars. They will eventually end up in Dacia, where they overcome the now weakened Avars and establish their own kingdom.

651 AD--Pharaoh Ahmosi IX dies, succeeded by Necho XV.

677 AD--Pharaoh Necho XV dies childless. As there are no male heirs in any
closely related branch of the royal family, the throne passes to the family of
Necho’s Queen, Neferhari, whose family comes from Thebes. The new ruler is
Neferhari’s nephew, a general in the Army. The new King is determined to
restore Thebes to its old imperial glory, and decides to take a royal name from
the Middle Kingdom period of Egypt (which was also ruled by a dynasty from
Thebes and whose literature he especially admires). Thus Sesostris IV ascends the throne as the first Pharaoh of Egypt’s 31st Dynasty.

681 AD--The Bulgars under Kubrat's son Asparuch attempt to cross the Danube but are defeated by the Romans.
 
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Here is another map...

egyptmap8.jpg
 
Interesting, very interesting.

On the Roman side of things, how is the Empire divided (you made mention of an Eastern and Western Empire)? Most of the territory lost looks like it would have been Eastern territory, leaving the Western Empire much much larger. Also, I don't think the Roman Empire is going to fall, as they've outlasted every serious threat. The only other major invasions are the Vikings, Magyars, and Mongols. The Vikings might chip away at some northern territory (possibly take the whole of Britain, if they're lucky), and the Magyars might take some of the Balkans, but thats it. The Mongols are too distant to really effect much of the territory Rome has.

Egypt seems to have ridden out most of its storm, too. though I'm not as well versed in the history of the area in the Middle Ages, the only real invaders were the Arabs (beaten), then the Turks and Mongols (well, the Mongols didn't attack Egypt, but they could have), right?

Have the Muslims split along the Shia/Sunni lines? Are they going to? Since they can't expand into North Africa (and likely never will, as that would end our continous native Egypt) and, for the time being, Anatolia, where might they be redirected? Russia, perhaps? Or more entrenched in India?

All in all, a good timeline.
 
DominusNovus said:
Interesting, very interesting.

On the Roman side of things, how is the Empire divided (you made mention of an Eastern and Western Empire)? Most of the territory lost looks like it would have been Eastern territory, leaving the Western Empire much much larger. .

Actually, if I made mention of an Eastern and Western Empire, that was a mistake that must have slipped through the final proof-read. The Roman Empire has never been divided.

DominusNovus said:
Also, I don't think the Roman Empire is going to fall, as they've outlasted every serious threat. The only other major invasions are the Vikings, Magyars, and Mongols.

I agree. As I see it, when the Romans advanced their frontier first to the Oder then to the Vistula, they absorbed almost all of the Germanic people who caused them so much trouble (and eventually toppled the Western Empire in OTL...the Franks, Lombards, Burgundians, Allemani, Suebi, Angles, Saxons, Jutes, Visigoths, Vandals, and others. The Ostrogoths live beyond the Roman frontier, and as stated in the timeline, get absorbed by the Huns). These areas have been under Roman rule now for centuries, and the people within them are quite Romanized. There are doubtless many large urban centers scattered over the region, and the area is quite populous (which allows Rome to maintain quite large armies). Also, by advancing the frontier to the Vistula, they gained a very defensible line (shorter and much more defensible than the Danube/Rhine line was in OTL, in my opinion). I am assuming that the Romans have some pretty extensive fortifications on this line, too. So I think the Romans in this timeline are going to hold out for a long, long time.


DominusNovus said:
The Vikings might chip away at some northern territory (possibly take the whole of Britain, if they're lucky), and the Magyars might take some of the Balkans, but thats it. The Mongols are too distant to really effect much of the territory Rome has..

The Vikings should prove an interesting challenge for Rome, but I agree that they won't make major permanent inroads. They didn't really do that in OTL, either, against much weaker opponents. Britain might fall, as you say, but the continental portions of the empire are pretty secure. As for the Magyars, I think they are going to be channeled into Dacia by the Roman fortification line like the Huns, Avars and Bulgars before them. The Mongols too, when and if they come (The Romans are about the only military power that I think would have had a chance of defeating the Mongols in the OTL, so I think that would carry over here, where the Romans are stronger anyway).


DominusNovus said:
Egypt seems to have ridden out most of its storm, too. though I'm not as well versed in the history of the area in the Middle Ages, the only real invaders were the Arabs (beaten), then the Turks and Mongols (well, the Mongols didn't attack Egypt, but they could have), right?

I agree. I think you will see repeated Arab and Turkish attempts to invade over the centuries, but of course they fail. The Mongols might try it too, but without a navy, the Mongols really don't have much of a chance to break through Egypt's defenses.

DominusNovus said:
Have the Muslims split along the Shia/Sunni lines? Are they going to?

I am thinking probably not in this timeline, but I haven't really decided that yet.

DominusNovus said:
Since Islam can't expand into North Africa (and likely never will, as that would end our continous native Egypt) and, for the time being, Anatolia, where might they be redirected? Russia, perhaps? Or more entrenched in India?

I am thinking they will expand north into Russia and east. I think the Indian subcontinent will fall, leading to a completely Muslim India eventually. Possibly they continue eastward into southeast Asia or even China. I have not worked all that out yet, of course. And of course if they expand into Central Asia, they might conquer the Mongols before Genghis Khan arrives to unite them. [/quote]

DominusNovus said:
All in all, a good timeline.

Thank you...and the ideas yourself and others have contributed are most appreciated too. It may be a while before I post the next segment. Hopefully I will get it done by next weekend and can post it then. :)
 
Vikings NOT

Given that TTL has held Denmark & the southern shore of the Baltic for close to five hundred Years. I don't see the Tribes of Scandia taking to the Raiding Life
Even if the Roman Milatary-Political never moved in Traders, Missionaries, and Explorers of various types would have. As such there would be a Strong Romanized segament, Dependent on continued peaceful interaction.

Likewise the northern most area in Scotland, & all of Ireland whould surcome to Roman Infulence, if not Control.

Like wise given Roman control of North Africa [Maurintia] They would probally have moved down the west coast at least to the end of the Atlas mountains [OTL Morrocco]
 
DuQuense said:
Given that TTL has held Denmark & the southern shore of the Baltic for close to five hundred Years. I don't see the Tribes of Scandia taking to the Raiding Life. Even if the Roman Milatary-Political never moved in Traders, Missionaries, and Explorers of various types would have. As such there would be a Strong Romanized segament, Dependent on continued peaceful interaction.

Not necessarily. This didn't happen to Ireland, for example, which sat alongside Roman-controlled Britain for almost 500 years. Irish raiders were a continual plague on Britain during the entire time the Romans were there. I see no reason why the Norse should, in principle, be any different.

DuQuense said:
Likewise the northern most area in Scotland, & all of Ireland whould surcome to Roman Infulence, if not Control.

Likewise, the history of OTL argues against this.

DuQuense said:
Like wise given Roman control of North Africa [Maurintia] They would probally have moved down the west coast at least to the end of the Atlas mountains [OTL Morrocco]

Again, they didn't in OTL...why in this ATL?
 
Nice TL, Robert! Very interesting and the subject is refreshingly different from most ATL's! Hope to see more of it!

Best Regards!

- Mr.Bluenote.
 
robertp6165 said:
Not necessarily. This didn't happen to Ireland, for example, which sat alongside Roman-controlled Britain for almost 500 years. Irish raiders were a continual plague on Britain during the entire time the Romans were there. I see no reason why the Norse should, in principle, be any different
And besides, a Roman Europe would be far richer than a disunited feudal Europe. If anything, the Norse would be even more interested in raiding, IMO.
 
"And besides, a Roman Europe would be far richer than a disunited feudal Europe. If anything, the Norse would be even more interested in raiding, IMO."

But a rich powerful Roman Europe could also go north and lay the proverbial smackdown on anyone who bothers them. Could the various opponents of the Vikings land legions in the Viking homelands and burn them (the homelands, I mean, not the legions).
 
Matt Quinn said:
"And besides, a Roman Europe would be far richer than a disunited feudal Europe. If anything, the Norse would be even more interested in raiding, IMO."

But a rich powerful Roman Europe could also go north and lay the proverbial smackdown on anyone who bothers them. Could the various opponents of the Vikings land legions in the Viking homelands and burn them (the homelands, I mean, not the legions).

This is true, but again, the example of Ireland argues against it. As I said earlier, I don't think the Vikings are going to make major inroads into Roman territory, but like the Irish, they could prove very irritating as raiders. And depending on what is happening on Rome's eastern border, they might very well be able to snap up Rome's off-shore territory in Britain.
 
Points

IIRC the problem with Hadrians Wall was that there ended up being Romans on both sides as Roman infulence seeped north.
Given that you have a smaller Scotland north of the Romans, and they have been along the Irish sea Longer than OTL.......

The Denmark Straits are Narrower and easier to cross than the Irish Sea........


The Romans Didn't make a large push down the Morrocan coast IOTL Thro they did explore down to the Fortune/Carnary Islands, But OTL didn"t have a {Rival Empire} streching from the Red Sea to Cape town either.
 
Saite Timeline, continued...

Here is the next installment...

SAITE TIMELINE, 700 AD-1000 AD

c. 700 AD--Over the previous millennium, the Norse peoples of Scandinavia
have been slowly developing sleek, double-ended boats. These are oar
powered, and carry only small crews, and are capable of only short coastal
voyages in sight of land. Even in these limited craft, the Norse have made
themselves a nuisance with raids on Rome’s northern frontiers. However, about
700 AD, two innovations (the T-shaped keel, which strengthens the vessel
against heavy seas as well as allowing a mast and sail to be mounted, and the
sideboard rudder) are made by Norse shipbuilders in Norway which will enable
the Norse to leave their home waters and become not merely a nuisance, but a
plague. However, it will be a few decades still before these designs are
perfected, and the fearsome Viking longship makes it’s appearance on the world
scene.

700-730 AD--period of relative peace in the Middle East as the Omayyad
Caliphs, now based in Damascus, Syria, consolidate their gains. Conquered
peoples are treated somewhat tolerantly, being allowed to continue to practice
their own religions if they pay a special tax. Most people in the conquered
regions convert to Islam rather than pay the tax. The Jews in the province of
Yehud and elsewhere are a major exception, however, and there are other
groups scattered through the Caliphate who do not convert, as well (some
Christians, Zoroastrians and Manichaeans in Persia and Mesopotamia, for
example). North of the Caucasus, however, a new power is rising...the Khazar
Kaganate. The Khazars had already made their presence felt a few years earlier,
when they forced the Bulgars westward against the Roman defenses on the
Vistula and the Danube. They also are a very tolerant people, and many Jews
and Christians who do not wish to pay the Muslim tax on their faiths will flee to
the Khazar lands over the succeeding decades. The Khazars will become a
major player in world affairs in the centuries to come.

702 AD--Pharaoh Sesostris IV dies, succeeded by Amenemhet V.

729 AD--Pharaoh Amenemhet V dies, succeeded by Rameses XXI.

730-731AD--Khazar troops commanded by Barjik destroy an Arab army at the
Battle of Ardabil, then conquer Azerbaijan, Armenia and northern Iraq for a brief
time. However, Caliph Hisham I rallies his forces and drives the Khazars back
north of the Caucasus the next year.

731-740 AD--War between Egypt and the Caliphate. Taking advantage of the
temporary weakness of the Arabs following their defeat by the Khazars, Pharaoh
Rameses XXI decides to attempt to retake Egypt’s lost possessions in Asia, and
invades Palestine. The local Jews rise against their Muslim overlords when the
Pharaoh’s armies cross the border, and with their support, Rameses is able to
clear the Muslims out in short order. He follows up with an invasion of Syria, and
by 733 AD, has pushed the frontiers of the empire back to the Euphrates.
Caliph Hisham I, forced from his capital at Damascus, attempts to reconquer the
areas by invasion every year, but finally, in 740 AD, signs a peace treaty
recognizing the new frontiers. The Omayyad Caliphate re-establishes it’s capital
at Mecca.

737--The Arabs defeat the Khazars. The Khazars are forced to convert to Islam.
However, both the conquest and the conversion are short-lived.

740-753 AD--Pharaoh Rameses XXI orders construction of new fortifications to
defend the Asian possessions of the Egyptian Empire. Many new fortresses are
built, and old ones re-vamped. Egyptian Fire projectors are installed in all
fortifications.

740-780 AD--Muslim expansion in India and central Asia. By 780 AD, the
Caliphate has taken the entire Indian subcontinent, and has pushed its borders
to the line of the Jaxartes River, Hindu Kush Mountains, and the Himalayas. The
island of Ceylon is also taken. This will mark the furthest extent of the
Caliphate’s borders in the east, as the formidable terrain barriers in the south
and the formidable tribes of nomadic horse archers in the north halt the Arab
drive eastward.

749-750 AD--Abbasid Revolution topples the Ommayad Caliphate. The
revolution arose from several factors. One major impetus was the secularism of
the Omayyad caliphs. The Omayyads had always been outsiders—as a wealthy
clan in Mecca, they had opposed Muhammad—and the secularism and
sometime degeneracy that accompanied their caliphate delegitimized their rule
for many devout Muslims. The Abassids took their name from al-'Abbas, a
paternal uncle of Muhammad and early supporter of the Prophet, and their close
kinship to Muhammad and the position of al-'Abbas as a Companion of the
Prophet served them well in gaining support. A final impetus was the exclusion
of non-Arabs from the highest levels of Islamic society under the Ommayads,
which lead many non-Arab converts to Islam, especially in Mespotamia and Iran,
to support the rebels. In a bloody uprising, the Abbasids massacre almost all of
the Omayyad House and sieze power, their leader, Abu al Abbas, being declared
Caliph in 750 AD. A few surviving Omayyads flee westward to Egypt, where they
are given sanctuary and maintain a sort of “Caliphate in Exile,” with the support
of the Pharaohs (who see the potential to use them to forment instability in the
Caliphate, thus weakening a dangerous enemy).

c. 750 AD--In west Africa south of the Sahara, various petty kingdoms and city
states have arisen, influenced by trade with the empires to the north and east.
The area is rich in gold, and supplies other exotic goods obtained from the
coastal forests to the south. In about 750 AD, the king of the city of Kumbi Saleh
unites the various city states in the region, forming the Kingdom of Ghana. Over
the next few centuries the Ghanaites expand their holdings until they have a
substantial empire in western Africa.

750 AD--Muslim armies attempt to move north from the Caucasus onto the
plains of what will one day become Russia, but are defeated by the Khazars.

751 AD--Arab armies meet the armies of the T’ang Chinese Empire at the Talas
River, in central Asia southwest of Lake Balkhash. The Chinese are defeated,
halting their expansion into central Asia. However, the Arabs do not pursue the
retreating Chinese, and their empire will expand no further eastward, either.
Chinese prisoners taken at the battle introduce the art of paper making to the
Arab world. It will spread quickly along the trade routes, reaching Egypt (where it
fails to make much of an impression in a culture where papyrus-making has
been an art for over 3,000 years by this point) and Rome (where it becomes very
popular as an alternative to imported Egyptian papyrus) by the end of the
century.

753 AD--Pharaoh Rameses XXI dies, succeeded by Sesostris V. Sesostris
continues his father’s policy of building fortifications in Palestine and Syria.

755-757 AD--War between Rome and the Caliphate. The Romans are pushed
back in Asia Minor to the line of the Halys River. However, the Muslims are not
able to make any further gains, and a treaty is signed.

760 AD--Pro-Omayyad rebellions in Arabia, formented by the Omayyad exiles in
Egypt, with Egyptian support. The Abbasids brutally crush these rebellions. The
sacred Kabaa in Mecca is burned to the ground, creating much shock and
resentment among the Arabs.

762 AD--War between the Caliphate and the Khazars. The Khazars invade the
Caucasus regions under control of the Caliphate, but are forced to retreat.

764 AD--Recognizing that the base of support for the new Abbasid regime is not
in Arabia (which is still quite pro-Omayyad) but in Mesopotamia and Iran, Caliph
Abu Jafar al Mansur founds a new city on the Tigris river in Mesopotamia, called
Baghdad, and established a new capital there.

777 AD--Pharaoh Sesostris V dies, succeeded by Sesostris VI.

c. 790 onward--Persecutions of Jews in the Roman Empire. Many Jews flee to
the Khazar lands, where the Kagans grant religious freedom to everyone.
Others flee to the Egyptian Empire, which follows similarly tolerant policies.

795 AD--Norse raiders begin ravaging the coasts of Roman Britannia and
Ireland.

795 AD--Pharaoh Sesostris VI dies, succeeded by Seti VIII.

c. 800 AD--The first Norse settlements are made on the islands off the coast of
Pictland and Scottia (the region north of the Firth of Forth on the island of
Britannia which is not held by Rome). Also at about the same time, Norse
traders begin moving down the rivers which penetrate the interior of the continent
from the Baltic coast. They meet and trade with the native Slavic people who
live along major rivers such as the Don, Dneiper, and others, and many of them
settle down. Beginnings of Norse settlement in the region.

801 AD--Pharaoh Seti VIII dies, succeeded by Rameses XXII.

805 AD--Norse raiders attack the coasts of Gaul and Hispania for the first time.

807 AD: In the years after their arrival in the region north south of the
Carpathians and north of the Danube, the Bulgars have mixed with the Huns,
Avars, Goths, and Slavs who live in the region, and by 800 AD have even
adopted the local Slavic language as their own. However, they have not proven
to be much of a threat to Rome, living peacefully most of the time. However, this
is about to change. In 807, Krum becomes king of the Bulgars. Krum is very
aggressive, and the plunder available in the Roman lands south of the Danube
looks very tempting...

810 AD: Bulgars, under King Krum, attack the Roman Danube defenses. They
are repulsed. Also in this year, the Roman navy clashes with the Norse in the
Oceanus Britannicus (OTL English Channel) off the coast of Cantia (OTL Kent).
The Romans have never established a true ocean-going navy, using poorly
adapted Mediterranean warship designs, and the swift, agile Norse vessels
decimate the Roman fleet. From this time onward, the Norse will control the
western seas. Communication between Roman Britain and the portions of the
continental Roman Empire becomes very problematic.

811 AD: The Roman Emperor Honorius III decides to punish the Bulgars for
their raiding, and leads an army across the Danube. Krum's Bulgars defeat the
Romans and kill the Emperor in battle. Less than two thousand of the
70,000-man Roman army escape across the Danube.

813 AD: Krum of the Bulgars again assaults the now-weakened Danube
defenses. He breaks through and sacks Hadrianopolis. Other cities in the
region pay tribute to avoid a similar fate.

814 AD: While on his way to storm the important trading city of Byzantium, which
has refused to pay tribute, Bulgar King Krum dies and is succeeded by his son
Omurtag. Omurtag’s army is severely defeated by a Roman army outside of
Byzantium and forced to retreat north of the Danube. The Bulgars will pose no
threat to Rome for quite some time to come.

820 AD--The Norse begin settling on the coast of Pictland and Scottia. They
quickly overcome the Picts and Scots in battle, and establish control over large
areas. Within 50 years, they will (by conquest and intermarriage with Scottish
and Pictish ruling houses, who, like the Norse, are pagans) bring all of Scottia
and Pictland under their control. Also in this year, pro-Omayyad rebellions again
break out in Arabia. Once again, they are brutally suppressed by Persian troops
loyal to the Abbasid Caliph.

825 AD: the Arab mathematician Al Khwarizmi of Baghdad writes a book on
"Hindu numerals" that spreads the use of "Arabic" numerals

830 AD--The Norse begin settling in Ireland and in Roman Britannia. In Ireland,
they establish towns at Cork, Dublin, and other places on the coast, and quickly
subjugate the Irish tribes living nearby. In Britain, Roman power initially limits the
Norse to small coastal enclaves, and the Romans are able to maintain control
over most of the island. This situation will continue for many years.

840 AD--Pharaoh Rameses XXII dies, succeeded by Amenemhet VI.

849 AD: Caliph al-Mutawakkil deposes the patriarch of the Christian Church and
persecutes Christians.

c. 850 AD--Driven by the Turkic Pechenegs, the Magyars (a Finno-Ugrian
nomadic tribe living in the region north and east of the Black Sea and allied to
the Khazars) migrate west. They reach the plains east of the Roman defenses
on the Vistula by 860 AD. These lands are inhabited by a Slavic tribe called the
Polanie, who call the area Polska. The Magyars settle among the Polanie and
establish themselves as a ruling class in the region. Also at about this time,
Roman missionaries convert the King of Ghana to Christianity. Ghana thus
becomes the first Christian state outside of Rome.

850 AD-The Persian mathematician Khwarazmi invents Algebra.

860 AD--The Norse discover Iceland.

861 AD--Pharaoh Amenemhet VI dies, succeeded by Amenemhet VII. Also in
this year, the Khazar Kagan, Bulan, converts to Judaism.

862 AD--The Magyars raid Roman territory, breaching Roman defenses on the
Vistula and causing much damage before they are finally forced to retreat by
pursuing Roman armies. Over the next 30 years, the Magyars will continue to
periodically raid into Roman territory, but they are not interested in territorial gain,
just plunder...for now. The Romans are able to buy relative peace most of the
time by making large payments in gold to the Magyar. Also in this year, the
Norseman Rurik becomes ruler of Novgorod, founding the State of Rus. Rurik
becomes the first Prince of Rus.

863 AD--Boris, King of the Bulgars, converts to Christianity and allies his
kingdom to Rome.

869 AD--Pharaoh Amenemhet VII dies, succeeded by Seti IX.

870 AD--All of Ireland has been brought under the control of the Norse.
However, the control is somewhat tenuous. Irish kinglets still reign over most
areas of the island, but swear allegiance to Norse overlords in Dublin. This
situation, of course, could change at any time. However, as in Scottia and
Pictland, the pagan Irish (who had no St. Patrick to convert them to Christianity
in this TL) and the pagan Norse actually have a great deal in common, culturally,
and the two groups get along quite well most of the time. Gradually over time,
intermarriage will erase the few differences that exist between them.

872 AD--The Norse kingdoms in Scandinavia are united by a chieftain from
Norway named Harald Fairhair, who takes the throne as King Harald I. Harald
asserts his claim to rule over all the Norse lands, and his claim is accepted by
Norse in Britain, Scottia, Pictland, and Ireland. The Norse in the land of the Rus
do not, however.

874 AD--Iceland is settled by the Norse.

875-880 AD--In 875 King Harald I of the Norse leads a large army to Roman
Britain with the aim of conquering the island. The Norse establish a large
enclave on the island, centered on the city of Eboracum (York). The Romans are at this time very pre-occupied with the Magyars on their eastern border,
and over the course of the next 5 years, the Norse continue to expand their
enclave. By 880 AD, they have overcome the last Roman resistance, and the
entire island is under their control.

877-879 AD--War between Egypt and the Caliphate. In 877, Muslim armies
invade Syria, but are unable to take the Egyptian fortresses in the region.
Frustrated, the Muslims lay siege to Damascus. An Egyptian army arrives in 888
to confront them, and in a bloody battle, the Muslims are defeated and forced to
leave Syria. A peace treaty is signed the next year.

879 AD--Prince Rurik of the Rus dies, succeeded by Oleg.

882 AD--The Rus, under Oleg, conquer Kiev, siezing it from the Khazars. Oleg
moves his capital there from Novgorod.

888 AD--Pharaoh Seti IX dies, succeeded by Rameses XXIII.

889 AD--The Magyars, under King Arpad, have migrated from the plains east of
the Vistula to the lands south of the Carpathians, in the Danube basin. They are
met by the armies of the Boris, King of the Bulgars, and soundly defeated. The
Magyars retreat back to Polska.

897-899 AD--In 897 King Arpad of the Magyars breaches Rome’s Vistula
defenses, and this time the Magyars sweep all the way to the Oder River before
they are finally stopped at the old Roman defenses on said River (which the
Romans have kept in repair as a second line of defense ever since the frontier
was pushed east to the Vistula). These the Magyars are unable to breach, and
the front stabilizes. The Romans counterattack the next year, and two Roman
armies are defeated and severely mauled as a result. Accepting the fait
accompli, the Romans sign a treaty with the Magyars in 899, ceding the area
between the Oder and the Vistula to the Magyars.

875-1000 AD--Slow disintegration of the Abbasid Caliphate. Various areas,
including Persia, Afghanistan, and the Indian subcontinent, establish themselves
as virtually independent of the Caliphate, while still officially acknowledging the
hegemony of the Abbasid Caliph in name, if not in fact. The Caliphs, who have
over the years fallen into degeneracy and weakness, allow this to happen with
little protest.

907 AD--Oleg of the Rus leads a fleet across the Black Sea and attacks the city
of Byzantium. With the help of a Roman fleet, the city withstands the assault.
Oleg signs a treaty with Rome later that year.

910-915 AD--War between Rome and the Norse. In 910 AD , a Roman fleet
crosses from the Jutland peninsula and lands an army in southern Norway while
King Harald and the main Norse fleet are off raiding the Gallic coast. Before a
messenger ship can reach Harald, the Romans have established control over
most of the Scandinavian portions of Harald’s kingdom. Harald’s response is to
rally the Norse of Britannia and Ireland, raise a huge army and fleet, and then
invade Norway himself in 912 AD. Harald defeats the Roman general Maximus
Aurelius and utterly destroys his army, and Scandinavia is once again safely
Norse. The war sputters on for another three years, mostly consisting of
inconclusive clashes between the rival fleets in the Baltic and North Seas.
Finally, a treaty is signed in 915 in which Rome recognizes Harald’s claim to his
conquered territory in Britain and elsewhere, in exchange for a guarantee of an
end to Norse raiding on Roman territories. Harald will keep his agreement until
his death. His successors will not.

913 AD--Pharaoh Rameses XXIII dies, succeeded by Sesostris VII.

918-920 AD--War flares up between Rome and Egypt. For centuries, there has
been ongoing tension between the two powers in the disputed lands separating
their respective holdings on the northern coast of Africa. In 918 AD, Pharaoh
Sesostris VII decides to resolve the simmering conflict by siezing the disputed
lands. However, Sesostris is killed in battle against the Romans in 920 AD,
leaving no heirs. There are several legitimate and not-so-legitimate contenders
for the throne, however, and Egypt falls into civil war for three years, during
which time Rome siezes not only the disputed lands but the city of Cyrene on the
Libyan coast as well. Brief Interregnum in the line of Pharaohs.

922 AD--The Magyars under King Zoltan break through the Danube defenses
and raid into Italy, causing much damage. They are finally beaten by a Roman
army and forced to retreat back across the Danube.

923 AD--The Royal Vizier of Sesostris VII has emerged victorious in the
three-year civil war following the death of the Pharaoh in battle. The Vizier is a
commoner with no links to the old royal family, and needs to legitimize his rule.
He comes from Memphis, former capital of Egypt under the Old Kingdom, and
he declares his descent, in long line, from the great Pharaohs of the Old
Kingdom (using a fabricated genealogy, of course). He takes as his
own the name of the Pharaoh who built the Great Pyramid, and thus, Khufu II
comes to the throne of Egypt, beginning the 32nd Dynasty. The new Pharaoh
moves the capital to Memphis later that year. He also signs a treaty with Rome,
recognizing Roman title to the disputed North African lands, and purchasing
Cyrene back with a hefty payment in gold.

925 AD--Pharaoh Khufu II enacts laws to dramatically raise taxes. This is to pay
for the huge construction project Khufu has started in Memphis, as he rebuilds
the city to match his own ideas of imperial splendor. The nemhu (land-owning
bourgeosie), who are most dramatically impacted by these laws, are very
resentful. Their resentment grows even more when Khufu starts arresting
recalcitrant nemhu who refuse to pay the new levy and feeding them to the
crocodiles. Khufu also resurrects the ancient practice of marrying one’s sister
and forbidding royal princes to marry outside of the royal house. This causes
widespread consternation in Egypt, where the practice had been largely
abandoned for almost 1000 years.

930 AD--King Harald I Fairhair of the Norse dies. His son Erik, known as “Blood
Axe,” takes the throne as King Erik I. Erik abrogates the treaty with Rome, which
he opposed at the time it was adopted. Norse raids against Roman Territory
resume with full force.

935 AD--King Erik Bloodaxe is killed by the Romans during a raid on the Gallic
coast. His cousin, Haakon, asends the throne. Haakon is a Christian, one of a
growing number of Norse Christians converted by Roman missionaries who have
been travelling north for the past several decades. However, King Haakon does
not force his subjects to embrace the new faith, and when he dies, the
succeeding Norse ruler will be a pagan.

939 AD--War between the Khazar and the Rus. The Rus armies under Prince
Igor are defeated by the Khazars, and a treaty is signed shortly afterward.

948 AD--Roman missionaries convert King Bulcsu of the Magyars to Christianity.
Bulcsu signs a new peace treaty with Rome later that year. However, the
conversion and the treaty will be short lived. When Bulcsu dies two years later,
the new Magyar King Tacsony will be a pagan, and will resume warring against
Rome.

955 AD--Pharaoh Khufu II dies, succeeded by Khafre II. Khafre II will continue
the oppressive policies of his father, causing further resentment among the
nemhu, who had hoped for some relief from the new Pharaoh. Also in this year,
the Magyars under King Tascony suffer a major defeat at the hands of a Roman
army while raiding in Germania. So badly decimated are the Magyars that they
will no longer pose a threat to Rome after this date.

965 AD--Pharaoh Khafre II dies, succeeded by Pepi III. Also in this year, the
Rus under Prince Sviatoslav defeat the Khazars at Sarkel. The Khazar fortress
at that location is captured.

970 AD--Pharaoh Pepi III is slightly mad, probably due to the inbreeding going
on in the royal house since the reign of his grandfather, Khufu II. Pepi claims a
right which is unheard of in Egypt (but which would be called droit du seigneur in
OTL Europe)...the right to demand the favors of the daughters of any of his
subjects on their wedding nights, or payment of a large fine by the bride’s
husband in lieu of said favors. Pepi rarely partakes of the favors of his subject
brides, using the law as a way to squeeze money out of wealthy nemhu without
having to formally raise taxes. However, the few times he does partake are
enough, and lurid rumors spread throughout the land of the depravity of the mad
king. This touches off rebellions in different parts of the kingdom, but the army
for the most part remains loyal, and the rebellions are put down. Pepi will
remain uneasily on his throne, mad as ever, until his death 28 years later.

975 AD--King Geza of the Magyars accepts Christianity. This time it will be a
permanent conversion for the Magyars.

982-985 AD--Erik the Red explores and names Greenland, after being outlawed
for three years on account of manslaughter in Iceland.

986 AD--Southern Greenland is settled by Erik the Red as he leads the first
settlers from Iceland. Erik the Red settles in Brattahlid (today's Qassiarsuk)
which becomes the center of the Eastern Settlement.

988 AD--Prince Vladimir of the Rus converts to Christianity. The first church is
built in Kiev.

990 AD--Bjarne Herjulfson is blown off course while sailing from Iceland to
Greenland, discovers land to the west of Greenland, but does not investigate
further. He instead proceeds to Greenland, where he relates his story to Leif,
son of Erik the Red.

992 AD--The Seljuk Turks invade Transoxania (Ilkhan) and convert to Islam.

995 AD--King Olaf I Tryggvason, who converted to Christianity before ascending
the Norse throne, declares that his kingdom shall be Christian. By a combination
of force and persuasion, Olaf sets about converting his pagan subjects. There is
of course much resistance, but Olaf is ultimately successful, and the Norse
Empire becomes a Christian realm.

998 AD--Pharaoh Pepi III dies, succeeded by Khufu III. However, Khufu will
reign for less than a year before being toppled in a coup by an army general who
claims descent from a house related to the Saite 26th Dynasty. The people of
Egypt, who have always considered the Memphite kings of the 32nd Dynasty as
usurpers and have groaned under their oppression for decades, support the
rebellion wholeheartedly, especially the nemhu, or land-owning bourgeosie. The
new Pharaoh takes the throne as Psamtik XV, and thus begins the 33rd Dynasty.
The new Pharaoh moves the capital back to Sais.

1000 AD--The Quiet Revolution in Egypt. For centuries, the nemhu, or
land-owning bourgeosie, have been quietly gaining influence in Egypt. Their
sons make up the majority of the rank and file of the military, and they
themselves serve in all sorts of posts in the royal administration. But they crave
a larger voice in the affairs of the empire, and the new Pharaoh owes them, in
part, for his own place on the throne. So, when a council of the leading nemhu
demands to be heard, Psamtik listens. The council bemoans the abuses of
power which took place under the Memphite Dynasty, and demands that a
written constitution be drawn up to clearly delineate the powers of the Pharaoh
and to protect the rights of the Egyptian people (especially the nemhu, of
course). Psamtik agrees, and a committee, composed of the Pharaoh and
representatives from the nemhu, meets to craft the document. After several
months of hard negotiating, a document is crafted which is acceptable to all
sides. The Pharaoh retains his powers as head of state and chief High Priest of
the state religion, including complete control of how state revenues are spent.
However, he is to be advised by a Council of the 100 Elders, who will be elected
from among the nemhu once every four years. The Council has the power to
approve or disapprove new taxes and other measures which may imfringe on the
rights of the people, such as changes to criminal law, property siezures, etc. It
also must approve of any decision by the Pharaoh to declare war on a foreign
power. Psamtik XV signs the document, and the first Council of the 100 Elders is
elected shortly thereafter. What emerges is the world’s first constitutional
monarchy. It is not a democracy, or anything close to it. But Egypt has taken
it’s first steps in that direction. Also in this year, Leif Eriksson leads an
expedition from Greenland to explore the lands sighted by Bjarne Herjulfson ten
years before. His expedition discovers what is in OTL the regions of Labrador
(which they call Helluland--Stone Land), Newfoundland (which they name
Markland--Forest Land), and Nova Scotia (which they name Vinland). They
winter in Vinland, then return to Greenland.
 
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Looking good. I think you're being a bit rough on the Romans. :p And butterflying away only St. Patrick, when ya kept everyone else? :rolleyes:

Nah, its all good. I think the Romans would adopt Norse ship designs by now though, to help even things out. Might a Roman general retake Britannia in about 66 years or so, by any chance? :D
 
740-780 AD--Muslim expansion in India and central Asia. By 780 AD, the Caliphate has taken the entire Indian subcontinent

Not so easy for Islam to overrun India that quick. Afganistan was as difficult for invaders then as it is now. OTL the Hindu kingdom of Kabul resisted Islam for 4 centuries, and in the end to Islamize Afghanistan needed such massive slaughter that the main mountains there are still named Hindu Kush, which is Iranian for "Destruction of Hindus". After that, Hindu Indian kings resisted and resisted, and in much of India when Islam depopulated an area, the area did not become desert like in Iran etc but often went back to the jungle, and the next time the Sword of the Prophet marched that way it found the land choked with secondary regrowth jungle at its most intractable and tangled stage and no feed for horses and plenty chances for ambushes. OTL more recently the Mogul Empire overran the Indus-Ganges plain fairly easily but in the south of India got bogged down in a tangle of steep mountains and jungle-choked valleys. India did not suffer the last Ice Age and so mountain valleys did not get glaciated to U-shaped cross section with flat floors handy for armies to march up.
 
Anthony Appleyard said:
Not so easy for Islam to overrun India that quick. Afganistan was as difficult for invaders then as it is now. OTL the Hindu kingdom of Kabul resisted Islam for 4 centuries, and in the end to Islamize Afghanistan needed such massive slaughter that the main mountains there are still named Hindu Kush, which is Iranian for "Destruction of Hindus". After that, Hindu Indian kings resisted and resisted, and in much of India when Islam depopulated an area, the area did not become desert like in Iran etc but often went back to the jungle, and the next time the Sword of the Prophet marched that way it found the land choked with secondary regrowth jungle at its most intractable and tangled stage and no feed for horses and plenty chances for ambushes. OTL more recently the Mogul Empire overran the Indus-Ganges plain fairly easily but in the south of India got bogged down in a tangle of steep mountains and jungle-choked valleys. India did not suffer the last Ice Age and so mountain valleys did not get glaciated to U-shaped cross section with flat floors handy for armies to march up.

All true...on the other hand, the Arabs are able to devote much more attention and resources to subduing the subcontinent in this timeline, as they are not busy subduing north and east Africa. Would it have been enough? Extremely likely? Maybe not. Possible? I think so.
 
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